Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 20, 2019 02:55PM
Situation: Test puller (or early hook if they look at a few) breaks. Sled reset. Can't come back.

This happened to Bunnage and Parrish last weekend. I know setting the sled is inexact, but in these situations, through no fault of the puller, they are unable to run for a check.

It's not the puller's fault the sled was too light or heavy. Nor is it the promoter's fault. In this situation, should the sanctioning body pay the pullers who broke and unable to hook at the "official" sled setting. I'm thinking the equivalent of the lowest placing payout, or aut least full refund of entry fee.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/21/2019 01:55AM by The Original Michael.
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 21, 2019 01:33AM
Correct me if I'm wrong someone, but doesn't PPL pay pullers who have to re-hook to the sled due to a sled reset?


Brent Yaron
Hooked Up Pulling Productions
hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 21, 2019 03:16AM
Is it the sanctioning body's fault the tractor broke?
What do they get paid? what would they have got paid if they were not test hook and broke?
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 21, 2019 03:26AM
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Pay what
Is it the sanctioning body's fault the tractor broke?
What do they get paid? what would they have got paid if they were not test hook and broke?

The issue is when the sled setting is changed. You omitted that important point. If the test hook breaks and the sled isn't changed, they get whatever payout they get for the place they finish.

If they pull, break, then the sled changes and the class reatarted, they don't have that opportunity. For your second question, I offered suggestions in the original post.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/21/2019 03:27AM by The Original Michael.
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 23, 2019 04:23AM
Quote
The Original Michael

Is it the sanctioning body's fault the tractor broke?
What do they get paid? what would they have got paid if they were not test hook and broke?

The issue is when the sled setting is changed. You omitted that important point. If the test hook breaks and the sled isn't changed, they get whatever payout they get for the place they finish.

If they pull, break, then the sled changes and the class reatarted, they don't have that opportunity. For your second question, I offered suggestions in the original post.

This happened to us this year.....and quite frankly could cost us 1st place in the points race. Not complaining but it is what it is!
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 27, 2019 12:55AM
If test puller breaks while on first hook, and it's obvious, then the sled operator should take into consideration that fact and a full pull mark should be set instead of resetting the sled, so as to not screw the first puller over. Do what you can to avoid having to re-set the sled, and the class, make other adjustments like to full pull mark. Obviously if everyone is going out the back gate does require reset. Sometimes seems to me some operators/promoters are too quick to do a reset, and not take all factors into consideration.
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 23, 2019 02:23AM
The age old breakage question and who should "pay" is interesting but not highly possible to institute. Pay for the total vehicle or just the damaged parts? Lots of questions to determine.

NO sanctioning body pays for damage ON TRACK or in competition. NASCAR doesn't pay for wrecks and NHRA doesn't pay for cars that blow up during a pass. The biggest reason is that it's part of the competition. It's a part of the game. Not ideal but you pull and you hope that you can pull off the track under your own power.

One area that contributes to this is a dollar amount. Each vehicle is different in its construction and the parts that are used. Pulling is different from any other motorsport in fact that we have to have "a sled" in order to compete. The sled setting AND track building are not exact science. However, the track is pretty much the same for every competitor and there will be a winner.

Tech services, sled operators always strive for a good sled setting and show, it's not always possible. Sometimes damage happens on the test hook, that is very unfortunate and many times not avoidable. Of all the national hooks, very few end in damage to the competition vehicle, that doesn't make it ok when it does happen.

Generally, NTPA pulling insurance does pay for damage to vehicles in transit and/or not in competition. (NTPA membership and event sanction etc. are factors.)
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 23, 2019 02:48AM
Doc,
I don't think he is talking about paying for the damage. Rather he is talking about the fact that since the class is restarted you technically didn't hook and therefore are not eligible for points or prize money. He would like to see the puller get last place prize money (and presumably points if applicable).
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 23, 2019 05:04AM
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Deere Puller
Doc,
I don't think he is talking about paying for the damage. Rather he is talking about the fact that since the class is restarted you technically didn't hook and therefore are not eligible for points or prize money. He would like to see the puller get last place prize money (and presumably points if applicable).

Correct. If not the equilavent of last place money at least a full refund of entry fees.
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 23, 2019 02:48AM
I’m pretty sure you get paid already? If there are 5 tractors, first hook breaks and sled is reset. He gets 5th place and 5th place money. How it is here anyways.
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 23, 2019 03:49AM
.......and what happens when there 10? or 25? or 47?

That statement and formula doesn't work so good now, does it?
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 23, 2019 05:02AM
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wrong number
.......and what happens when there 10? or 25? or 47?

That statement and formula doesn't work so good now, does it?

If you're referring to the original post, the idea is fine. If a class is restarted after 25 hooks, something is amiss unless it's due to sled breakage.
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 23, 2019 10:47AM
ON the other hand a lot of text hook tractors that don't break comes back later a wins from getting a free chance and a feel of the track just like the fist hook turning his pass down
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 23, 2019 12:24PM
This is a really interesting topic. Should the competitor get a full refund of his entry fees? Man this is a real grey area. One could argue that since the sled was reset and since he didn't officially hook in the class then he should get his money back since he didn't hook in the class he intended to. On the other hand one could argue that he did hook to the sled therefore deserves no monetary compensation. He made a pass and he put wear and tear on the sled and he was part of the show... even if in an unofficial capacity. He added to the sled operators workload as well as the workload of the scraper and roller drivers and the laser crew. Those entry fees help cover those expenses in a way.

Is it the sled operators fault? If so should the group/individual that hired the sled pay (the sled is their subcontractor after all)? If the Promoter hired the sled then shouldn't they pay? Or if the NTPA of club hired the sled should they pay?

Is a partial refund warranted? I'm stumped on this one.


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Independent Pulling News


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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 23, 2019 06:26PM
ok, this situation happened to both Bernie Platz and I years ago at Washington, Mo.. Bernie was first puller and we were second. I don't remember the distances but he broke the front end out from underneath him and broke1 turbo in half. Then we were the test puller and blew the bottom end of the motor completely out at about the same distance. After we got everything cleaned up and both of us were trying to get everything loaded the promoter told us that while we were hooked to the sled that the sled had a problem but the sled operator didn't know about it until after we hooked and asked both of us if we could come back and there was no way that either one of us could. That's part of pulling and we accept that. The sanctioning body did split last place points between us. We never got an entry refund($20 at the time) nor did we ask for one. Also that winter when I tore our engine apart, I found the problem with our engine and the sled had NOTHING to do with it. Some one built a part wrong and I didn't check the part because I trusted the builder. So I am just as much to blame for it happening.
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 24, 2019 12:46AM
I believe that if you are in Champions Club with PPL, they will pay you $250 if the sled has to be reset, Mears takes that really seriously and closely monitors how the sled operator is setting up the sled so that it keeps resets and pulloffs to a minimum, this is how it should be.
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Re: Should the sanctioning body pay in this case? August 24, 2019 01:01AM
Baloney! Every ppl pull I've ever been to has had multiple sled resets sometimes more than 1 in the same class!!!
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