01:37:08pm, Tuesday, April 16, 2024
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Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Registered: 07/06/2008 Posts: 1,347 |
Does an emergency mean anything goes, including enumerated (listed) rights in the Constitution?
Was it a unwise for a pastor in Tampa to have church Sunday? I believe it was, but even so, freedom of religion AND peaceable assembly are specifically named in the first amendment. If he appeals, I can't see this passing muster with the Supreme Court, unless the USA is morphing into the USSR. Should New Yorkers flee to their summer homes in Rhode Island or Florida? A case could be made they should stay put, but it was decided long ago in early Supreme Court rulings that one state cannot bar travel to/from another state. The Rhode Island situation is even worse because they were going to send either police or National Guard door to door. Is there a 2nd Amendment? California (at least parts of it) deemed Gun Stores as non-essential until the Trump Administration said a day or two ago those were essential, then they backed down. Consider, as cities and some states are letting people out of jail, then making it more difficult to defend family and property. (side note- you're going to arrest someone for not having a government approved reason for being out, but release some dude to beat his wife?????) Should the Virginia Governor have locked everything down until June 10 (10 weeks away)? Good luck getting people to comply after April. A former Mayor of Chicago said "Never let a good crisis go to waste." There are a lot of good things happening, but at the same time, even with the medical situation, I do not support giving up freedoms. Most people do not deny the seriousness of the situation, but at the same time this virus will eventually pass. However, I find even worse than the virus is the authoritarian streak some politicians are displaying. Recommendations are good, but the threat of locking someone up for being out with out an "essential reason" for a longer period of time than for an assault or battery conviction strikes me as the cure being worse than the disease. Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/31/2020 03:45AM by The Original Michael. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Moderator Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 1,445 |
I know that the corvid 19 topic is front and center in everyone's minds and I see the question about "will we have truck and tractor pulling this year" ? I certainly don't have crystal ball to see into the future, however I do believe that if there is a 2020 pulling season it will not be at the national level. I am not sure if NTPA or PPL can or will run a partial schedule. I say this for several reasons, one, the economy will lag by months at the end of the corvid 19 pandemic. Without jobs for a vast number of both pulling fans and pullers themselves they will be strained just to keep food on the table and a business afloat. The next question is will major sponsors be willing to invest money into advertising with pulling? I fear that the national shutdown/social distancing will go on much longer that just a couple more weeks. And this also begs the question, will pullers have the money to operate at the same level as before corvid 19? Sure some will, money never seems to be a problem, however there are those pullers that are just barely keeping up with their bills day to day. And the next question is how does this look, how does this look to not only their laid off employs but to the public. A lot of fans and promoters are uncomfortable with spending money, to big a risk now to take. People [hopefully] will see the world different now, the high debt, low income operations will struggle just to survive. I don't really believe that we will go back to the good old days [2019] any time soon, I do believe that the economy will lag the corvid 19 victory. I hope I'm wrong, I pray that one of these new drugs being tested will be successful. Dick Morgan www.PULLOFF.com Independent Pulling News |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Registered: 02/23/2012 Posts: 542 |
Those are both very true statements
We all hate to give up our freedom but if we ALL would use some common sense we might have a chance but I still fear the lawlessness that could happen if we are FORCED to be locked down The heathens of the world don’t care about getting sick so I can see the looting being out of control and spilling out into the country eventually and then we have a powder keg that will be worse than the virus If they know the law can’t keep up they will go nuts and then you have martial law and that will be the end of things as we know it Just my 2 cents. BE AWARE OF YOUR SURROUNDINGS AND HAVE A PLAN NOTHING WORSE THAN A RABID ANIMAL WITH NOTHING TO LOSE |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Registered: 04/04/2008 Posts: 1,521 |
I think it's going to stay this way until a vaccine is found.are you going to chance death for a tractor pull,I bet you wont.the key to having any sporting events is a vaccine.i do wonder when 60,000 die of influenza in the usa,why is this virus such a big deal with only a little over 3k dead now |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Agreed
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Thats 3K dead in 10 days. It will be 4K tomorrow. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Registered: 03/26/2008 Posts: 494 |
T.O.M., I would question your interpretation of "the right of the people peaceably to assemble..." in any situation, because following that gives a condition for that assembly: "and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." As far as closing gun stores, that might fall under Article 1, Section 8: "provide for...general Welfare.." and Amendment X (reservation of power to the states). The Second Amendment might not apply because there would be no infringement of person keeping or bearing Arms. And where can I find the Supreme Court casework regarding the denial or exclusion of citizens of one state being denied passage to another state? (just curious). Comments do not expressly reflect the beliefs of the poster and are for informational and/or entertainment purposes only. JW |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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David B
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Having a job and being able to spend money will be the reason pulling comes back or not. I know a bunch of friends that are pretty worried about the jobs. Not sure about pullers but I don't think many of them are much different than anyone else |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Registered: 07/06/2008 Posts: 1,347 |
JW, I will try to address your points. You are combining peaceable assembly with the redress of grievances. The 1st Amendment reads "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances" There are 6 separate items this amendment entails (establishing religion, prohibiting exercise of religion, freedom of speech, freedom of press, peaceable assembly, and redress of grievances). The redress of grievances is not just an add-on for peaceable assembly, it is a specific enumerated right on it's own. Each comma denotes a specific God-given right as written down by the founding fathers. I never said "in any situation," that was putting words in my mouth. However, not one but two specific enumerated rights are in play with a peaceful meeting of worship at a church. Again, I never said it was a wise thing for the pastor to do. So, are you saying someone can keep and bear arms, but they can't purchase a gun or ammo for it? Isn't that like saying you have a right to eat, but you can't buy food at a grocery story if a state so decrees (following the same thought process)? This is somewhat moot as the Federal government issued clarifying guidance that gun stores are considered essential. Remember, states and cities are releasing people from jail out into our communities. One ironic point- the LA County Sheriff that reopened the gun stores yesterday just got a lot of his power taken away today, ostensibly for handling of 2018 fires... very suspicious timing, don't you think? For convenience, I'll pull from wikipedia, though it's far from being a legal journal. It begins with "As early as the Articles of Confederation the Congress recognized freedom of movement (Article 4), though the right was thought to be so fundamental during the drafting of the Constitution as not needing explicit enumeration", then lists a number of cases that deal with different aspects of interstate travel, many not relevant to this point. It lands on a 1999 decision "The U.S. Supreme Court also dealt with the right to travel in the case of Saenz v. Roe, 526 U.S. 489 (1999). In that case, Justice John Paul Stevens, writing for the majority, held that the United States Constitution protected three separate aspects of the right to travel among the states: (1) the right to enter one state and leave another (an inherent right with historical support from the Articles of Confederation), (2) the right to be treated as a welcome visitor rather than a hostile stranger (protected by the "Privileges and Immunities" clause in Article IV, § 2), and (3) (for those who become permanent residents of a state) the right to be treated equally to native-born citizens" Wikipedia Freedom of Movement w/i USA Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 03/31/2020 01:50PM by Jake Morgan. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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LEWIS
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Somerset ky ONE INFECTED attended church now eleven infected now at this point in time its not a bit different than selling meth to someone and they die from a overdose Someone who wouldnt stay home just comitted Murder could be any one of us that kills our Grampa or someone elses .and as Paul Harvey said thats the rest of the story |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Registered: 02/23/2012 Posts: 542 |
Yep Lewis you’re right
I read where they caught a guy in Lexington at the airport he had flew in from New York knowing he’d tested positive and was contagious that is considered murder when done intentionally He should be tied to a tree for the buzzards |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Registered: 03/26/2008 Posts: 494 |
The "federal government" decreed gun stores being "essential", I am sure, because POTUS needs to keep his base happy. What is essential--I can buy ammo at Walmart. As far a the enumeration of the rights in Article 1, why do all of them (not withstanding the establishment of religion), begin with "or" except for the grievance portion. Based on the vernacular of the day, my point might be viable for interpretation. lol JW |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Face in crowd
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"The right of one man to swing his fist ends where another man's nose begins."
There are all sorts of limits to our freedoms. 1st amendment- You can't go into a movie theater and yell "He's got a gun" or use meth as part of your religious worship or "peaceable assemble" on a busy street during rush hour without proper permits. And so on.... The government can and should put limits on people's freedoms during a pandemic. We can have hundreds of people die because some jackass doesn't want to miss a Sunday offering collection. And that is all it was. They had the capacity to broadcast their message and help to save lives. Lives that God put on this earth and instead he broke the law and most certainly spread the virus further. The government has to force people to make good choices because if left to decide for themselves, some people will not make good choices. And that is what has got us in this mess. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Yeah, in an all and just world I couldn’t agree with you more, but there are people out there that are power hungry and would love to use this time of destitute and desperation to spread their wings and limit our freedoms. It’s already happened in Hungary just this week. We need to stay vigilant and not cede any more power to the government. It’s a critical time. The way they took $2 trillion dollars is a perfect example. Before you know it there won’t be any self righteousness, privacy or freedom left. be alert and what out for big brother. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Concerned
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I pray things get better. However, if the government gets too far out of control, I think that you will see a revolution that is beyond comprehension. The government already fears the people, all because of the corruption they know they are partakers of. Praying hard for a 180 from the direction that we are headed. God is in control, he will protect his people. Trust and be ready! Know Jesus as your personal Lord and Saviour, it will all come to pass. Be safe and aware. As many have said before, Wash your hands. May God Bless you all. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Festus Haggin
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You are EXACTLY right !! |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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ONE
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Face in the crowd is spot on. "Freedom" isnt the right to do whatever you want and endanger other people. It's also a double edged sword..you can't pick or choose your outrage over perceived constitutional injustices to suit your beliefs.. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Its a VIRUS just like the Flu.
30,000 die from Flu EVERY year,nobody says a word. This Wuhan China Virus aka;Covid 19 hits people the hardest with already weekend immune system or underlying health problems. ex; elderly and people w/,copd,asthma,heart problems. But......SO does the FLU. Professional athletes and people in good shape test pos and didn't know and have ANY symptoms of having it.Never did. ****Didn't take long for the Govt and media shut this country down out of 'fear' and caused mass hysteria,hording.***** IF CHINA hadn't lied for over a month,even had their Doctors who talked about it before they decided to tell the truth disappeared. the rest of the world could have gotten a head of it. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Really
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Lots of people worry about the Flu every year! How do you know that 30,000 die from the flu if nobody says a word? Do you have any idea how much money is spent every year on Flu vaccinations? The Flu killed roughly 32,000 people in the US in 2019 COVID 19 will go over your 30,000 number in April alone. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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JMO
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25 veterans commit suicide everyday
30+ die every day texting and driving 40+/- die every weekend in chicago 10,000 die from aids a year in USA 200,000 die from heart attacks a year in USA 500,000 die from cancer of some sort Abortion kills 5,000 a DAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We are gonna die from something,but this scare bs has went way too far.Govt/Media Crippled us and never fired a shot.We all turned into sheep? |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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LEWIS
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JMO if you think the Gov is spending Trillions and shutting everything down for what you think is just scare BS as stupid as you are go find someone who has it and lay the biggest kiss you have in you on them Stupid asses like you we dont need anyway tell the people all over the world thats already had someone close die your dumb ass statistics and se how they feel call me first if you want to |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Face in crowd
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Argue with ignorance and I will let you keep it. Just stay in your house so you don't spread this virus any further. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Really
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If, like you say "we are gonna die from something" then what are you complaining about? |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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xxx
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we flew in and out of China six weeks after we knew it existed --- before the experts got smart, a little too late,And China knew about it last October, and people are still flying and travelling, still going to church and gathering at parks, they are the entitled ones infecting the rest,new strain of flu, -yes stronger more tenacious.If you believe the numbers from anyone that just plain and simple don't know, it is a problem bigger than we know, like hp numbers on SS diesels, - pretty big guess range. |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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?
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I saw an Hannity or Carlson lastnight that a doctor or scientist one from China tried to warn us that it was coming, and she is missing now !!! They don't know what has happened to her !!!! |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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JMO
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More than 1 Doctor has came up missing.
Look up how many cell phone contracts have been deleted or cancelled.They are lying about everything.Seen a satellite view of what they think is a huge trench dug to bury bodies.bulldozer setting on site.Looked bodies in sheets lined up in rows in trench |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Moderator Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 1,445 |
JMO, congratulations you have just taken both sides of the same argument. Now you can't be wrong. Dick Morgan www.PULLOFF.com Independent Pulling News |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Really
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Wonder what the bodies are from? Surely not from this imaginary virus that isn't a problem at all. Was it our "Govt/Media" that killed them in an effort to sell toilet paper? |
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Re: Questions we as a country need to grapple with
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Registered: 04/04/2008 Posts: 630 |
The reality of the dire scenario we face is hitting the small town where my crew chief Rick works. 40 recent cases,six of his friends gone in a very short time. This is in a very small community so it is very real and definitely not just the flu. For those that still think it is a conspiracy I would suggest you look at places like Italy, and Spain. If it were a conspiracy dont you think it would have hit the US first and hardest?
Looks like a long road to recovery in any case. S'no Farmer |
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