09:45:33am, Thursday, April 25, 2024
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Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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BBRD
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Curious when the two main sanctioning bodies are going to crack down on these in tractor classes? As the shortened year is coming to an end its pretty obvious which people are running them, nobody wins every hook.
Thoughts? |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Posts: 1,160 |
Someone can fork up the money to protest them then, problem solved. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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huh?
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How do linelocks help in pulling? I dont know many tractors with front brakes! |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Sounds to me like you guys need to put the money in your toys and stop bitching. Either you spend big money or go home it’s the same in every Motorsport division I have been around. Bunch of grown men crying like babies cause you get ass kicked. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Techie
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I think the OP may have nomenclature mixed up.
Grease burner traction control is activated by brake application. Us tech people aren't supposed to know this. None of us know Davis Technoligies exists. SSSSSSHHHHHHH!!!! |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Truth
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U better go to the higher ups in one association a certain person who promotes a pull has a REAL obsession....no one wins all the time especially someone who has been busted before....also measure those 1st edition India made pro pullers 211-212-213..... |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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plum krazy
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much bigger issues than tire size,Why even care, some run whatever, so why same size tires????????? why not same turbo, fuel, driver, engine, paint, ect, WTF !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Why is changing fuel and water from sidelines ok, .,been doing that since the 90'zzzzzzzzzzz. anyone classes can run any tire, why some the Same? No difference than lower hitch, lower air in tires, weight placement, gear chosen. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Registered: 10/30/2018 Posts: 749 |
Why have rules if they aint going to be followed and the put the money up fork the money up is just a bunch of bull sh crap if joined to an organization such as NTPA PPL OR SUCH ITS there responsibility to assure a fair playing field not the pullers.If a puller or pullers fill they are being cheated by another puller it should only have to be brought to a Tech officials attention a protest is bullshit and should only be used at a UN Professional BRUSH PULLERS ASsociation that have rules but no tech |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Bud
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Thats been the problem for years. Time and time again issues have been taken to NTPA and the have done NOTHING. If something suspicious is brought to the tech officials they should be able to look at it without someone having to put up money. Although I hear in Iowa last weekend they tested water and all the GN superfarm failed. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Bud,your information about all of the GN superfarm's failing the new water test at Rockwell is flat incorrect. There checking procedure has changed for this year. Last year the water the all of the GN tractors ran came from the same place and passed the test at the time. The new test is different,but on the end of the track mine and the others I talked to passed, so where ever you got your information,you may want to get the facts first. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Question Of The Day
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Here’s a question for everyone. When and where have you actually seen a protest handled in the correct way??? The problem is people want to complain but few are willing to go the extra mile and put up the protest money. However it’s very hard to admit in some cases that a puller that wins regularly has perhaps came up with something new that no one else has yet and he has the upper hand. A lot of puller want to cry when they get beat but fail to try new things or think outside the box. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Answer of the day
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That is the same story word for word that JW tells his traveling buddy TW as he beats him and everyone else all the time...BS...again the dude has been busted before... |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Another question too !!!
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I got another question, when has anyone ever seen a tech session where the tech person really knows what their looking at or looking for, i know of 2 tractors that are running illegal after market heads in LLSS in midsouth an for some reason nothing is done about it, shouldn't have to put up money for a protest when it should be obvious if the tech person knows how to tech !!!! |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Registered: 04/03/2016 Posts: 772 |
And I have another question for you. Have you ever been a tech official? |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Another question too !!!
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No ive not, but if i were id know how before i accepted the position plain an simple !!! ( just because someone can tell if someone has a fever doesnt mean their a doctor)!!! |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Here’s your sign
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So here’s the simple answer to your question. Put up the money, it’s a no brainer. Either that or quit your whining. See how simple it is to solve a problem 
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Another question too !!!
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Money has been put up, they won't take the time to check !! |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Here’s your sign
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Then your problem is higher up. Go to the next level |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Exactly
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U said it all right there! In a perfect pulling world we would have paid professional tech officials that know the ins and outs of each pulling vehicle in every division but, as it is, we don’t live in a perfect world and very few want the job because no one wants to be the bad guy. The biggest problems as I see it are rules that are too vague and guys will get around rules that are clear as mud. Been happening for years! Or if there isn’t a rule in place for certain things and a guy does it and wins every time then people get angry and call the guy a cheater. Seen it many years ago in a hot farm/3000 rpm class. There weren’t enough rules in place (at the time) and a lot of guys just assumed what everyone else was doing and went with it until the “cheater” showed up and cleaned house every single hook!!!! Don’t blame the guy who wins all the time if there aren’t enough rules in place to begin with and he built a tractor that in fact was within the rules to begin with. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Another question too !!!
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Aint complaining about the rules that are written, rules plainly say " no after market heads " their are 2 that are running after market heads in mid-south,money has been put up, --- nothing done!!!! If a tech knows what their looking at no money should have to be put up cause it wouldn't pass tech in the first place. PLAIN AN SIMPLE !!!!! THATS ALL THAT WAS MENT BY ANY OF MY POST !!!! but as usual it got turned around that i was whining !!! Have fun telling me how wrong i am -- i know its coming !!!! |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Here’s your sign
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Here it comes: in your original post you blamed the tech official for not knowing enough to do his job correctly. You however failed to mention that the money was also put up to correct that issue. If after the money was put up for the protest and the check was not performed you have a problem higher up in your governing body. I’m not sure why this is so hard for you to understand. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Exactly
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If the money for protest has been put up and nothing was done then y’all got bigger fish to fry than after market cylinder heads it looks like. Poor leadership for sure and it’s probably time for new blood! Do y’all have a procedure in place if a pro test was made? Such as a tractor is taken to a local shop for tear down etc (if it can’t be done at the pull site). Heard of a protest done few years back at a local pull and it was contesting the cid of the tractor. The pan was pulled in the pits and the measuring tool used was a Stanley tape measure to check the stroke and bore of the engine. Now tell me how accurate is that! |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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the problem
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The problem is the kind of techman you want is extremely rare. Not many who know everything there is to know about both tractors and trucks are interested in the job. So clubs have to settle for whoever they can get. The real problem with pulling is everyone wants to get on here and complain or cry about cheaters instead of protesting. The rule is there for a reason. If you're so sure they're cheating file the protest. If you don't pull in the class and can't them give someone the money who can. Zero protests filed on pulloff ever get resolved. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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IH 5488
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Okay here is the issue I'm having. This particular tractor that we are all talking about is in a limited class limited Pro Stock. You are a limited by the cubic inch limited by the turbocharger the limited by the chassis you can run this is not super stock. If it was super stock this would be a whole lot easier to give him the benefit of the doubt. There are two other tractors that I remember that reeled off a series of wins similar to this one is Leroy Mason with the down and dirty the other is Bad Medicine. This particular tractor wins every pole he ghosted he has one in PPL Badger State Mid-South ntpa Midwest region and Regional polls with the ntpa and PPL. If you're beating the same group of tractors over and over I could believe the situation but the fact that no tractor in the whole country seems to be able to be ting-toomey throws up a red flag. It is not only the way he is winning but the dominance of his wins. If you would win by two or three feet every time I would say well he's got a 50 horse advantage and leave it at that but he is putting 15 to 30 ft on the second place tractor pretty much every time something is not adding up. I had a talk with an ex puller on the way to Louisville and he said well he's on the dyno all the time and is working on the his tractor all the time. Everybody goes dyno everybody works on their tractor that is only going to get you to a certain point that is the end of my rant but something to me doesn't add up |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Georgee
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there will always be someone dominating for a while, for many reasons, then another will take over.has happened since the beginning of time. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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the problem
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And, once again, if they're so sure he's cheating then protest him. I have no idea why they think broadcasting their grievances on here helps them. Is pulloff supposed to file the protest for them or something? |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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4.1 puller driver.
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Air ride front is also a issue. At Rockwell in staging area heard air being released turned around to see competitor letting air out and dropped front end of tractor several inches. Wonder how much it raised his draw bar. Sucks to see competitor do that. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Another question too !!!
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What part of " money has already been put up " for the protest and nothing done about it did you not get !!! Jus sayn !!!! |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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the problem
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Probably because a lot of us find it hard to believe that a real, legit protest had been filed and nothing has been done about it. This happened once with battle of the bluegrass years ago and the uproar was crazy. Stuff like that doesn't go unnoticed. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Another question too !!!
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Well it did happen !!! |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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the problem
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With what club? |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Another question too !!!
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The whole point is this --- it should of been caught at tech --- none of this would be an issue !!!! The good ole boy honor system no longer exists an shouldn't be relied on,Im done with this topic !!!! |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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the problem
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Like I said earlier, the techman simply may not have known enough to catch it at tech. That's why the protest system exists. If a protest was properly filed through all the correct channels and nothing done then the problem goes way, way beyond the techman. If you stated the name of the club this happened in you could probably start a revolution if everything you stated is true. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Here’s your sign
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You shouldn’t have started it. Clearly emotion is standing in the way of logical thinking. There is a system in place so use it |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Registered: 12/23/2018 Posts: 257 |
Very true! There are alot of great tech officials out there that work very hard and put up with alot of bs for little money. Many of the pullers are thankful for the tech officials that they have in their organizations so that they can have a pulling series. Just curious as to what is the going pay rate in 2019 for a tech official (to cover travel and working the event)? Local? State? National? Bottom line is to put up the protest fee if you think someone is cheating. The protest procedure is outlined in the National pulling rules; as for brush pulling it's probably not outlined in the brush pulling rule book. 
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Justin Wagler
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A person can learn a lot about themselves on this site . We were protested at Mexico for Cubic Inch at a Outlaw Pull. We took the head off and measured it and all was ok and I made $1.300.00 . Kurt and his group did a fine job at conducting the protest process I have a little bit of knowledge on this subject since this is number 4 in my pulling career. I don’t want stirr the pot anymore but if u feel the need to talk to me at pull about anything I welcome the conversation. I promise there is no fancy mythical traction control hooked to the clutch or throttle or anything else there is a set of brake calipers that I can manually adjust pressure on and release manually when I feel the tractor hooks all manually just a set of brake calipers. But if that doesn’t settle your curiosity then keep protesting because I can always use more money to dyno with. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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To IH5488
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Get to work 
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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xxx
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Not sure on correct wording on traction control, but most likely says "NO FORM " of any kind will be used,read above post.and again,if manual control is allowed, then the rule has zero value. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Justin Wagler
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Rule states has to be driver controlled ( Manual) or however u want to word it |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Clarifier
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No electronically controlled devices may be used. Manual controls are allowed |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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OK2NV
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Is adjusting brake pressure considered traction control now? And do you feel that using the brakes during a run is the same as using traction control? If you do you might as well write a rule outlawing rear brakes and make everyone go to front brakes only. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Registered: 01/03/2019 Posts: 280 |
Are you seriously suggesting that tractors are not allowed to use their brakes during the pulls? LOL. I wonder how many tractors would stay in bounds.... |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Registered: 07/27/2017 Posts: 184 |
Feels like some sour grapes. Anderson's Super Farm got thrown out of PPL (even if that was controversial) some form of rules were enforced. I've heard all kinds of accusations and to this point I haven't heard anything about actual violations or any proof of anything. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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LSS Fan
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Well that is pretty cool |
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I know why he's winning...
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Registered: 07/09/2008 Posts: 133 |
Meh, I still don't believe him.
I think he's got a tiny unicorn underneath the hood giving him extra power. Or maybe he's got a good luck charm like a super-cute 3 yr. old who helps him bleed his brakes. Yep, that's gotta be it. He's got an illegal toddler mechanic helping him. OR...maybe he's working harder and smarter than his competitors. Putting in longer hours. Studying harder. Want to beat him? Become a better driver, make more power, make your stuff run as hard as his...and quit whining, for cryin' out loud. It's getting old. |
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Re: I know why he's winning...
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Suburban housewife
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This post might be true IF he hasn’t been busted twice already...we are not talking about a choir boy here....wake up |
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Re: I know why he's winning...
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Registered: 03/30/2008 Posts: 191 |
What's he been busted for? |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Who are these 2 that you are referring to? |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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I bet
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I bet one of them was the one that got protested this past weekend that didn't even have the motor in it they thought it did lol |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Registered: 10/30/2018 Posts: 749 |
yES A LITTLE Cockshutt got protested for having a recast cummins head but was revealed as a true 570 front to back with a Hercules in it |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Registered: 04/04/2008 Posts: 1,522 |
It's amazing that after 50 years of national rules in a national org a competitor had to pay to have a inspection done in a vehicle,and that the inspection only covers said item..wonder why pulling been stagnant for decades |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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OK2NV
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Has anyone else here ever been a tech official at any motor sport event? The reason I ask is everyone loves to complain about a tech official not catching something or allowing part XYZ when no one else has it. From my personal experience (and this is part of why I retired from that position) there are usually several things in play. First I will say I do not know the NTPA or PPL rule book cover to cover but I am sure there are several passages in there that could be construed as interpretive. Basically I could see it one way and someone else could see it another and both of us could be correct. I have NEVER seen any rule book that is completely black and white. Second is how many hats is each tech official having to wear at each event? And thirdly, most people don't realize but you only get a fraction of the time that is needed to actually go over any vehicle. You don't have hours to go over each vehicle but rather a minute or two to make sure the correct safety equipment is in place and operational . Then a few seconds to go over everything else.Once that is done you complete the paperwork and off to the next competitor.
Once when working for a regional promoter we got tired of listening to everyone complain so we started offering jobs them the job of being a tech official. We only had two people agree and one did it for two shows and the other three. After that they had a whole new appreciation for what a tech official has to go through. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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HRC
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As a former tech official I wish there was a like button or a giant thumbs up for the above post. I once offered my flags to a competitor who disagreed with my decision at the end of the track. He refused to take them. It’s a thankless job that someone has to do. You learn quickly that you can’t please everyone and usually at the end of an event someone will be mad at you. It’s no wonder techs are hard to find. Not to mention the pay. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Registered: 04/04/2008 Posts: 1,522 |
Yes,I have |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Smoke Fan
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^^this guy knows what he is talking about!^^ |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Thought
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The way you all are saying it a throttle lever could be a manual traction control device too a whole bunch of pullers I have seen in my time don't bend the throttle over off the line they ease into it. |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Smoke Fan
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Throttle levers and brake pedals are forms of legal traction control when manually controlled by the driver.
When you tune an alcohol motor and have a computer limit the rpms in a curve off the line so all you have to do is give it throttle that is against the rules. At the same time it also keeps the motor from unloading over revving and coming apart. In a way it is great engine protection. But is illegal and an unfair advantage for someone who is not using it. Same for any driveline brakes controlled by a computer.
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Registered: 12/23/2018 Posts: 257 |
Preach on! Amen to that 
very true |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Registered: 10/30/2018 Posts: 749 |
It dont matter who has been a tech man and who has not everyone wants to compare professional pulling with Nascar what a joke LOL or however you want to take it Ntpa PPL or any of the other organizations has rules for each class its there responsibility to create a fair playing field for each puller they set the date build the track and get the money THE pullers are pulling for them sounds to me like theres a lot of confusion between a tech man and a safety inspector there wouldnt be so many compliants against Tech officials as ok2nv stated wich must be some Russian name or MOMA was really confused at the time of birth or the letters for a tech official really spells safety inspector LOL I WISH SOMETIMES I WASNT SO MUCH LIKE TRUMP AND TELL IT LIKE IT IS |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Tylor
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Lewis for president |
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Re: Linelocks and Traction Control-NTPA and PPL
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Joey
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Darn right, "MAKE PULLING GREAT AGAIN" !!!!!!!!! |
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