02:44:54am, Tuesday, April 30, 2024
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Esp billet block vote
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Leaving town
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Was the vote last night ?? What was the out come ?? |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Blue baby
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I heard hooters scooter was crying I'm not going to pull with ESP. Sounds like he spells team with an I. I heard it passed just not 100%. Hooters scooter would do better if their was a new driver. Good tractor just lacking for a driver. Mayb he could get the judge to drive it at Norwich. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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LSS puller
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Anyone heard of billet blocks being built for the LSS now that NTPA allowed it? |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Ppl puller
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Pretty sure ESP runs under PPL. Why would mark threaten to leave. Oh yeah because he won't so therefore he need a rule that would benefit him. If he wants to run that block go run where it was legal. The way it was voted on wasn't even right. Their was several ESP puller down in TN pulling. They couldn't even vote. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Ben Dover
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Blue puller and Ppl puller. You should put your post together. Same topic, |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Smoker fan
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Well here we go again when people don’t get what they want they start running there mouth |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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I would guess that PPL will allow LSS aftermarket as does NYPA soon enough. When a stock block splits at the cam line you lose everything and I would hope a aftermarket block will have the extra strength built in all the right places to keep all together. Like the heads....who wants a stock filled head that still cracks as opposed to a new recast head that is much stronger. I’m dollars ahead with a Hiems head once than 3 reworked JD heads. Back to blocks...I believe a aftermarket stronger block is safer, and may be cheaper in the long run and especially a billit block that is repairable than a throwaway. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Alkyfan
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The several pullers in tn would actually be 2 and most likely they would have been yes votes |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Just wondering
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So is this a rule for just the light super class or for both the heavy and the lights? |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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East coast
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Will east coast be ok with them? Heard same billet as chambersburg blues going to run. I'm sure if they have it . That will be legal. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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East coast pull fanW
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Run a billet you run a resticter plate. Even things up |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
Do you think the guys running the Hypermax block, the D&R block, the VG Motorsports block, or any other aftermarket cast blocks should have to run a restrictor plate to? |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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East coast pull fanW
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If resticter plate will not work then run what you bring and hopefully you bring enough safety and dependably should be the issue here all aftermarket blocks should run plates even things up and let the better driver sort things out. Not saying it will work just a option to look at |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
I'm not a fan of the billet blocks, but I'm also not a fan of aftermarket blocks like the Hypermax block either. If you're going to allow one then I think you should allow the other. Unfortunately the Hypermax block opened Pandora's box and I don't think there's any closing it now (aftermarket blocks shouldn't be legal in all classes because it's just not needed). IH and JD have the volume to get blocks cast for a “reasonable” cost but off-brands and less common blocks just don't have that luxury. Aftermarket cast blocks give the already dominate brands an even bigger advantage. Billet blocks are the most cost effective way to level the playing field.
Sure the off-brand guys, (Ford/New Holland guys in this scenario) could get custom blocks cast but it seems like a terrible idea. The blocks would probably be about $30,000-$40,000 per block because they would never get a volume discount and they wouldn't be any more repairable than the stock blocks. It would be such a poor financial decision that the only effect it would have on the sport would be to make those off-brands even more uncommon. Even though I'm not a fan of billet blocks, I completely understand why some guys in the class want them. If I was in their shoes and cracking blocks all the time then I'd put one in my tractor too. There are already some billet blocked SS tractors out there and nobody has seemed to notice or care because they don't dominate. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Problem solver
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You are correct Jake Hypermax did open Pandora's box but they did by working hard at it and beating the rules. This rule for ESP I was told ( and please correct me if I'm wrong ) was from Mark Hootman threading not to pull with the club anymore and that he was as going to pull ntpa if he could run the block. Pretty shallow sites man in my opinion. Mark has been at this sport a long time and if he used his mind on this one he too could have done the same to get this legal. How you ask ?? I would bet his old pal Corey knows enough people to make the right contact to get a part number for this. The same way hyper reached out to get a part number to beat the rule. But NO that's the new way to do things cry and they will be delivered. Either way he got his way. I just hope ESP doesn't get hurt from this as I hear they are losing tractors because of it. Signed NO NAME. Lol |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
First, Mark did try to get an OEM number years ago for a recast Ford/NH block. Mark and the Forresters couldn't get that done. Obviously a single dealership doesn't have the influence with CNH global than you seem to think they do.
Second, even if they did get a recast block with an OEM number it still would have been cost prohibitive, there are tons of potential customers for red and green blocks but the market for Ford blocks is limited, so production cost would have been outrageous (economy of scale). Third, John Deere already has aftermarket blocks with no OEM part numbers so the OEM number debate is actually pretty pointless for this day and age. He could have spent $30,000-$40,000 per block and had some recast, but that's obviously not what he wanted. Next, as for Mark "crying" and "threading not to pull with the club anymore" (I assume you meant threatening... ), I don't believe that was the case, or his intentions. Mark decided to go the billet route a while ago. When he made his decision he knew that it meant he wasn't going to be able to to pull with ESP without a rule change. He planned to pull in Ohio (the late Tracy Varns had run a billet Herc block in his Oliver for a while there) and with NTPA. Mark obviously loves ESP and has been a longtime supporter of the club. He went to the meeting to inform the club of his decision and the reasons why he decided it. Again, he was putting a billet block in his tractor no matter what, it didn't matter what the club decided to do. Sure he wanted the club to allow him to pull, but if they voted him down he was completely prepared to hook elsewhere and still have some fun this summer. He wasn't crying or threatening, he was simply informing them of his decision and to see where everyone else stood on the idea. Mark could have simply put the billet block in his tractor and not told the club and gone elsewhere and then you'd be complaining that he boycotted the club. He also could have simply got the billet block built, has it bead blasted and slathered some paint on really thick and nobody would have ever known. Heck, you can get magnetic paint and he could have fooled a magnet test. Instead he did the standup thing and told the club what his plans were. The club was free to decide whatever they wanted. |
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Re: question for jake
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Registered: 10/06/2008 Posts: 57 |
Hey Jake,
just a question in regards to the billet blocks, If you are recasting blocks there could be an advantage to the red and green show maybe?? but how would it hurt the less common color brands if they are making it out of true billet? guys made billet heads for the less common color brands. The machining centers, cad/cam and vision scanning systems are changing at such a rapid rate it almost makes your head spin. In low volume situations in next few years to come, it will be hard for the recast guy to compete with the billet guy especially if its made from aluminum. My thought is the scales are tipping. Trending in years to come as it becomes harder to find green, blue, orange and eventually even red oem parts with labor costs to prep and fit blocks on the rise. Your input materials, wages and interest rates billet blocks vs girdled/bored/re-machined/modified/clearanced oem components would come pretty close to a wash. |
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Re: question for jake
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Jealous
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Right their is a smart man. Amen |
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Re: question for jake
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
Ross,
I completely agree, that's why in my previous post I wrote: "Billet blocks are the most cost effective way to level the playing field." Billet for small volume runs is way more cost effective. Billet also has the advantage of weldability/repairability. Depending on how the billet is forged it can also have some grain structure advantages. Personally I think the advantages of billet far outweigh the advantages of having a block specially cast. Personally it seems like the DSS guys go through Hypermax blocks like water and eventually someone will find a billet solution that doesn't pound the bearings out and they'll save money in the long run. For all of the Pros of billet, I still don't think it's needed in every class. I'm a purest and in some classes I still want: OEM cast rear-end housings, OEM blocks, and OEM cast heads. Billet is great but I don't think there's a "one size fits all" solution. Some tractor classes should still have some tractor parts in them, in my opinion. |
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Re: question for jake
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big picture
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i personally dont think it should be allowed for light super. The light super is has alot more competitors and it wont be fair if 3 guys get billet blocks and the rest dont. Just making the class cost more yet.How many people a year actually are splitting there block,and most of the time its cause there was a self inflicted issue. Id say unlimited super stock can have them to give the 6 cylinders a chance against blackbourn but they too should be able to run billet. unlimited super stock should be the biggest,most expensive class because they are at the highest level of pulling |
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Re: question for jake
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the real impact
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I don't understand several of the things people in this thread seem to be worried about:
- how the method used to legalize them (voting or getting a "part number") changes any potential impacts to the rest of the class. - how they could be such a performance advantage that those without them will be at an unfair disadvantage. At best they may be a little lighter, but there are probably less expensive ways to shave weight than spend $15k on a billet block. I can't imagine there is much of a performance advantage when they are used. I do agree billet blocks will eventually reduce the cost of owning and maintaining the tractor, though. As someone pointed out, they are repairable, and should be equipped with most (if not all) of the strength upgrades required to use OEM blocks when they are made. Legalizing billet blocks will also open the door for the "off" brands, which will appeal to both pullers and spectators. Billet blocks will improve the class, not hurt it. |
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Re: question for jake
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Registered: 05/04/2013 Posts: 114 |
It would be a big advantage if they can run more boost. |
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Re: question for jake
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
Again, I'm not a fan of any aftermarket blocks, but how is this argument any different than allowing IH and CaseIH guys to run the Hypermax block? It's completely legal in LSS. Billet blocks aren't brand or color specific which is unlike the Hypermax block. Allowing billet blocks for all brands is actually more fair than the current rules. Pretty much all the Ford LSS guys are breaking blocks on a pretty regular basis. I was at Mark Hootman's shop this past Fall and I saw the cracked block from Rick Eakins tractor, some of Marks cracked blocks, Ben Clarks cracked block, Scott Adams JD (Ford powered) split the block two seasons ago, Ken Burkert's Sugartop Special and Mike Wilhite (before he became a cross dresser... I mean before his tractor became a cross dresser) split his share of blocks. Im sure if you talked with Kevin Lynn he'd tell you he's split some blocks too. Unfortunately it's a pretty common problem for most of the Ford LSS guys. I can also tell you that most (probably ALL) of those Ford guys are running 20-30 lbs less boost than most of their IH counterparts. Jason Hootman who arguably has one of the top if not the top LSS around seldom hits 100 psi. of boost. I haven't asked some of the other top guys like the Karlen and Chizek but they sure sound like their running 125 to 130 psi. Whether billet will help the class or hurt it I just don't know, but if you're going to allow aftermarket blocks (which LSS, DSS, OSS, HSS already do) then what's the difference between a billet block vs a recast block from a performance standpoint? |
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Re: question for jake
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Problem solver
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Jake I want to thank you and also want to point out that you are helping me prove my point on a couple of levels. First everyone like to tease wilhite but he went WITHIN the rules and didn't ask to change them. Like it or not that's part of why that rule was made to keep color in the classes easier. Just for the record I agree with you Jake. I'm not a fan of the rule but understand why. Second mark is like the guy that instead of working hard and correcting the problem he just chose to want a rule change. Kinda like a guy that wants to make a new class because the one he's pulling isn't working out for him. |
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Re: question for jake
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
Mark decided also to go 100% WITHIN the rules. He chose to pull with NTPA and with Ohio where the rules allowed him to be 100% legal with a billet block. That's exactly the same as what Wilhite did.
Mark went to an ESP meeting and told them what he was doing and ESP changed the rules. THEY made the rule change, Mark didn't change the rule, and Mark didn't make them change the rule. Wilhite chose to put an DT466 IH block in a Ford, Mark chose to put a billet block in a Ford... to me it's no different. Infact, Mark still runs a Ford crank and his billet block will fit all Ford parts (timing gears/cam/head/etc...) so it's actually more of a "Ford" than the route that Wilhite chose. Again, I'm not a fan of cross dressing blocks or aftermarket blocks, but they are already here in some classes. Since the rule is already in place to allow aftermarket blocks we should be consistent. All we are really discussing is the manufacturing process for aftermarket blocks, do we want the blocks to be:
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2018 03:20AM by Jake Morgan. |
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Re: question for jake
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Block Fannaticc
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To the novice,.. even maybe a engaged fan ,....if he walks up to a Hyper or a D&R after market block 99 times out of a 100 he wont know he's not looking at a block that wasn't out of a school bus salvage yard! So Jake would you rather have those fans experiencing that ? Or walk up to a solid straight rectangle engine appearing block that doesn't come even close to looking like a block out of a 1066 or a school bus ect ect??? |
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Re: question for jake
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
Well, who says a billet block has to look like a square rectangle? I know of a billet block that's been run for a while in a SS and nobody has been able to tell the difference.
Who says an aftermarket cast block can't have external machining and look like a square rectangle? To my knowledge there's no rule that says you can't do external machining to an aftermarket cast block. Jake Morgan Owner, PULLOFF.COM Independent Pulling News This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated. Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal. |
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Re: question for jake
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Well.....
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Who has the machined block that looks like a poured one block? |
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Re: question for jake
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
I was told in confidence, and I'll keep it that way. The recently departed Tracy Varns also ran a billet block, a 478 Herc block that was externally machined and didn't just look like a big "solid straight rectangle engine".
On a side note, Hull Moline does have a "solid straight rectangle engine", it has for years and years and years. The Molines run jugs and a crankcase instead of a one piece block, and the jugs were legally removed eons ago and replaced with a giant block of aluminum. With the side shields off all you see is aluminum. Buried way down underneath all that billet is a tiny cast crankcase. It was a great solution to keep that tractor reliable. Jake Morgan Owner, PULLOFF.COM Independent Pulling News This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated. Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal. |
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Re: question for jake
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Moderator Registered: 01/11/2009 Posts: 1,579 |
This is just a thought, not saying Im for or against improved castings or billet, but how many motorsports today still use OEM, meaning OEM taken from an assembly line vehicle, parts in the powertrain as a part of their top-level classes or divisions?
By the way there are improved castings floating around at every level of the sport and have been for a long time. It is a matter now to draw a line in the sand as to identify where this sort of components are acceptable or not. Bryan Lively - 
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Posts: 508 |
Anybody thats been trying to source OEM cast blocks and heads? just for rebuilding a stock farm tractor to get back in the field will tell you? It aint getting easier? The supply of original parts for all brands are quickly drying up! Allowing Billet will soon be a moot point! that is if you want to still see stuff go down the track?........ |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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reason
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And therein, Jim, is the whole reason why the pulling sanctioning bodies need to get with the times and allow todays modern tractor engines with 24 valves and EFI. Likely help cut the smoke issue which EPA is watching. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Perplexed
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I must be missing something or just plain dumb. These "tractors" have totally different transmissions, final drives, brakes, steering, heck the sheet metal isn't even factory on most of them. Why on Earth would the block have to be the only thing factory on these, let's face facts, modified machines. I could understand this logic if the tractor still had to actually still be a tractor using other factory components like in some classes. I quite honestly don't even enjoy the classes that these component tractors pull in. To me they are mods. If you're spending well over 100k to build one of these things I would want a billet block in mine. The whole argument against having a billet is totally ridiculous. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Posts: 513 |
^^^ What he said.. --- 
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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puller x
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all the billet block rule did is make pulling that much more expensive. And more expensive means smaller class sizes. Less pullers its already way out of most peoples budgets as it is so lets throw on another 20 grand to compete. Simple $1000 dollar fix would have been waste gate rules. As all the big light supers are running huge boost. All of them not just the red ones. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Block Fannaticc
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Are you a fan of allowing a block that only came factory in a john deere articulated 4 wheel drive? Hypermax got a part number. They followed the rules. As shady as it was they did follow the rules. 619's are not following the rules anyway,... shape,.... or form,... period. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Perplexed
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Now I see, that totally clears up the whole discussion. BTW did a 1066 come from the factory with a block stamped 466,467,or 468? |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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answer truther
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no |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
You're completely wrong on this one. This has been discussed hundreds of times on this page and the 619 is 100% legal and always has been. The 619 swings a stock 531 crank, just like a 474 Ford swings a 401 or 456 crank, just like a IH 414, 436, 466 all can interchange cranks. Just like the IH guys running the 468, just like some of the Deere guys running a 7.6L that only came in a combine. The rules allow the same OEM replacement for EVERY brand as long as the crank swings. It's pretty much always been that way. None of the blocks mentioned above are aftermarket, they are OEM. The 619 is a completely legal replacement. Jake Morgan Owner, PULLOFF.COM Independent Pulling News This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated. Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Block Fannaticc
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I guess I missed the memo about the rule amendment where they removed the two wheel drive stipulation. IH 468 was in the 88 series . Jake do you subscribe to the modern day main stream media mantra of,....... if we repeat it enough,..... it will make it true? |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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RH
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I may have missed it at some point but I don’t think anyone has mentioned that the billet blocks in question are NTPA legal. I believe at some point in the future PPL will also approve the billet block. All ESP did was approve this before their sanctioning body did. I don’t see what the big deal is. It’s a longevity and safety thing in my opinion. If you have ever been near one of these engines when they come apart you will understand. Will there be a performance gain with these blocks? Maybe. From what I understand they must be made with factory specs. I know I would feel better standing near one of these tractors running with a billet block rather than a cast time bomb |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
Yes, I mentioned it was legal in NTPA (and in Ohio State) and that was Mark's plan if ESP wasn't going to allow it. He was 100% within the rule in the places he planned to pull in 2018. Now he's 100% legal in ESP because that's what the club decided. It seems like a couple of complainers are making a lot of fuss for something the club deemed legal. Jake Morgan Owner, PULLOFF.COM Independent Pulling News This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated. Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
You didn't miss the memo, you just got everything ALL wrong when you read/interpreted it. Also, your statement is extremely vague. First, what organization are you talking about? Second which class are you talking about (there are numerous tractor classes after-all)? Third, are you sure your not taking those words out of context?
Context matters. Taking things out of context can be pretty dangerous. You can quote the bible and say that in Psalm 14 it says “There is no God.” and you'd be 100% correct. Now if you add some context you'll quickly see that it says The fool says in his heart, “There is no God.” context matters, historical context and precedent matter in this circumstance too. So I'll take a stab in the dark with a hypothetical since you were so short on specifics. Lets just say for instance that you're talking about the PPL Pro Stock Class, the rule book say as follows: E-Pro-Stock Tractor 2. Maximum cubic inch limit is 680. Maximum of 8 cylinders permitted. Acceptable blocks must have came from 2WD tractors. Side note, that wording doesn't appear with the other tractor classes like Limited Pro, Hot Farm, Super Farm, so one could assume articulating tractor engines are legal in the other classes if you took it completely out of context. So now lets look at the history of the class and how that rule came to be for PPL Pro Stock (and what it actually means): The Pro Stock class (along with the other tractor classes) have always allowed for the OEM replacement of an engine as long as that engine was able to swing the stock crank. That allowed the pullers to use engines from buses and all other types of vehicles as long as it was from the same manufacture if it was able to swing the stock crank without modification. This included, but was not limited to: buses, forage harvesters (choppers), combines, 4wd tractors, bale trucks, cotton pickers, trucks, and even marine applications to name a few. Again, as long as the stock crank fit and it was the same manufacturer it was OK to use. That includes the 619, the 474 Ford, and tons and tons of other blocks. The 619 has been a legal replacement for decades and decades at this point. Legally speaking that's called precedent. If the rules truly meant only blocks from 2wd tractors then all of the other options like bus and truck engines are illegal too since their not from 2wd tractors. If one were to take a strict, out of context, interpretation of the rule then most of the IH tractors would immediately be illegal if they run the big lifter bore truck block. The two wheel drive tractor rule you brought up is indeed a fairly recent addition to the rule book (and a poorly worded one at that). The rule stems from the "Any Ag Block" provision for the component tractor classes. PPL added the 2wd rule to the Pro Stock section of the rule book because they saw what had happened to the Open/Unlimited Super class in the past few years and competitors became concerned that the PS class would start to become a 903 Cummins class. Lance Little had already started to build a big V-8 John Deere for the class and they wanted to put a stop to it before it made it to the track. The rule was intended to keep only the big V-8 style engines from the articulating tractors out of the class. It's so poorly worded and poorly thought out. The spirit of the rule is what's being enforced. It's extremely poorly written but when taken in historical context it's very easy for anyone to see the intent of the rule. Again, I'm just taking a stab in the dark since you were so vague regarding what organization and what class. Again, the OEM replacement provision already covered the 619 block and the precedent was set decades ago. Here's one last part of the discussion, the 619 didn't just come in tractors, it also came in some Forage Harvesters (choppers). It's not just an articulating tractor engine. Just like the Ford 474 that didn't come in tractors... It's a legal replacement just like the other replacement options for other brands. Jake Morgan Owner, PULLOFF.COM Independent Pulling News This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated. Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Ok
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Jake are you implying that there is now and has been a super stock tractor in New York running a billet block? |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
I never said New York. There are Super Stock tractors all over this great country. One of the fun aspects of owning this page is that I get to talk with pullers from all over. I'm not going to say where he/she/they pull, what color tractor he/she/they run, or any other details. I'm not going to entertain or allow any guesses or speculation either.
As a side note, I just read a PM that I got from page user Patches and he reminded me that Tracy Varns billet block was made from billet tool steel. I'd love to see how a billet tool steel block would work in a DSS application. I've heard that some DSS pullers have tried a billet steel block (don't know what steel alloy) but had bearing problems but I love to have more details. Again, I'm not for aftermarket blocks, but if we're going to allow them then why should it make a difference how they're manufactured? Jake Morgan Owner, PULLOFF.COM Independent Pulling News This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated. Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Registered: 08/02/2008 Posts: 236 |
Tracey's bearings always looked perfect. The only exception to that is the end of last year. When it pushed the crank out and cracked the crank he didn't have another fully counter weighted crank ready to put in so he stuck a factory 6 counterweight crank in it to finish out the season. It was pretty hard on bearings for the rest of the year.
If I remember right the piece of 4140 he used was normalized, machined within .020, heat treated and stressed relieved, then finish machined. |
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Re: Esp billet block vote
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Billet considerations
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I think they would be a great addition especially if they had to retain some oem look so they would appear recognizable to an average fan |
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