trivia time!! March 16, 2020 08:34AM
with the whole world in a state of panic, lets lighten the mood a bit!! question: who was the first puller to utilize reverse rotation engines in a modified tractor?? I have my guesses, whats everyone else think??? stacy
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Re: trivia time!! March 16, 2020 08:40AM
Engler?
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Re: trivia time!! March 16, 2020 09:20AM
Leo Kay with the driller or maybe one of the Allison powered machines?
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Re: trivia time!! March 16, 2020 10:15PM
Someone with Allisons. No idea who it would be though.

CP
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Re: trivia time!! March 16, 2020 11:21PM
Bud Wheeler


Dan Mayer

www.pulling-reference.com
Dedicated to Preserving the History of Tractor & Truck Pulling
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Re: trivia time!! March 17, 2020 03:45AM
Walsh’s 5 Arias Irish Challenger?
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Re: trivia time!! March 17, 2020 05:18AM
Willy, that's who I was thinking too! not sure if it is fact, was thinking we might get more responses, but with coronavirus, and a LLSS thread, not so much!! LOL. also as I thought about it walsh may have been the first automotive style engines to do do it, but, like grubby and cpr said, the allisons were probably the first. EJ Potter had the Double Ugly tractor. it was a W-24 Allison. not absolutely sure, but one of the engines should have been a reverse rotation, and that would make him the first! Lets all hope we can go pulling this year!! Stacy.
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Re: trivia time!! March 17, 2020 05:54AM
Walsh's first modified was Allison powered. I still think leo Kay may have had one of the first automotive set-ups.
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Re: trivia time!! March 17, 2020 11:50AM
did Leo have a reverse rotation engine on one transverse mounted ones? never thought about the 5 engine set ups at the time having reverse motors, although I know Bauers did it when they came out with a big tractor. correct also on walsh's having Allison's Grubby. they had 2 I believe, one was john shauls before they got it.
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Re: trivia time!! March 17, 2020 11:58AM
Walsh chassis came from John Shaun which was new stat of the art at that time with rodecks- bac-man engines and two were reverse rotation.?
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Re: trivia time!! March 17, 2020 12:00PM
SHAUL
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Re: trivia time!! March 18, 2020 02:37PM
Fred Mende and Bob Bend. Thats why they used a Minneapolis Moline because the engine was in Reverse rotation from factory.
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Re: trivia time!! March 18, 2020 03:07PM
Andy,I do believe that you are correct...I remember reading about that..
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Re: trivia time!! March 19, 2020 04:21AM
Wasn't shaul I bought his motors rodeck with brodix heads
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Re: trivia time!! March 19, 2020 07:49AM
Key word here is engines. Meaning more than one. Just gotta give you crap Andy!
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Re: trivia time!! March 19, 2020 01:03PM
I wonder if reverse rotation helps at all, because, all the power is going into the same driveshaft turning one way anyway. I feel the this the main cause for all the frame twist that goes on. I know some feel it makes a big difference. I am skeptical myself.
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Re: trivia time!! March 19, 2020 02:16PM
Perhaps the Eldon Townes / John Knox (Brian's dad) Hemi powered "Sassy Massey".
Young teenager Brian was already quite the mechanic / gearhead / envisioning inventor and an astute observer and thinker.
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Re: trivia time!! March 20, 2020 02:30AM
plb,
I've often thought about just what you are talking about and I would agree with you to point that driveline torque is a big part of the equation. I think one of the factors involved is that the gearboxes on most Mods are pretty far back on the chassis where they are attached to a thicker stronger part of the chassis. The torque is still there but the chassis twist is much less.


On Tarrys Feissty tractor we found that we needed to stiffen the frame with two engines compared to when Bill Vories ran it with 4 and 5 engines. I've also seen photos of the tractor with 4 engines twisting harder than when it had 5 engines. I think the method of mounting the engines in some cases helps to stiffen the chassis. Our chassis had way more twist with 2 engines than Bill had with 4 engines his gearbox was mounted back by the fenders while ours is mounted in the middle of the chassis. We have actually stiffened that chassis two times since we've had it.

Having said all of that remember that most of the time that Bill had that chassis the tires were likely not nearly as good as what we now run. We do mount our 3rd engine backwards and I think It does help somewhat with reducing and offsetting chassis torque. In the end I'm thinking that ultimately the torque applied at the rearend doesn't change much regardless of all of these other factors.

Another thing that I've noticed over the years is that the higher the front of the tractor gets to more the torque seems to affect if the tractor goes straight the higher the more the tractor wants to go left.

I'm not an engineer by any stretch so these are just my observations and are very likely not very accurate.

S'no Farmer



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2020 02:32AM by S'no Farmer.
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Re: trivia time!! March 20, 2020 11:05AM
I talked with the guys on the Green monster team from Germany while in Zwolle last month, and they are trying to get left and right rotation engines in the lite mod for this summer sometime. With both turning the same way, It goes to the left at the hit of the throttle they tell me. We talked a bit about this very subject and they are positive it will help. I guess time will tell with that tractor. I think they might be bettor off, Off setting the hitch too. Is that done now by anyone?? Perry
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Re: trivia time!! March 21, 2020 03:16AM
I could see it making a big difference with Allison's as they have so much torque. The hitch on my tractor is able to be offset but we run a pretty substantial spacer in our left wheel. Thats one of my first changes on our old chassis years ago...made a big difference but I still think the biggest difference was putting the engines side by side and being able to hold down the front of the tractor.

S'no Farmer
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Re: trivia time!! March 21, 2020 03:25AM
lOOKS LIKE CHASSIS TWIST DESIGN IS BEST SOLUTION,,some seem to twist up to a foot or more.
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Re: trivia time!! March 21, 2020 04:33AM
My old chassis that I started in the mod class with twisted a LOT and worked great but the compromise was that you had to really keep an eye on the driveline parts as they could wear pretty quickly because of the misalignment when twisting so hard. I learned that one the hard way when a coupler and shaft let loose mid run...that engine got ugly in a hurry.

S'no Farmer
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Re: trivia time!! March 21, 2020 08:14AM
thanks for all of the input !! Sno Farmer, really enjoy your comments on this this board! haven't seen any dispute as to walsh 5-arias irish challenger, being the first reverse rotation auto motive powered mod. that tractor was so way ahead of its time.... remember those were 640 ci engines too!!
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Re: trivia time!! March 21, 2020 10:41PM
And the offest mounting of those engines quite visibly that I have yet to see repeated.
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Re: trivia time!! March 21, 2020 08:16AM
Running a spacer is good idea. I also remember some pullers setting the engines to the left side if the chassis to combat lift on the left side too. Perry
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Re: trivia time!! March 21, 2020 08:26AM
no pure gains in anything in Life, give and take and hope the reward is more than the cost. Just the way it is. My tractors pulling in the shed, with me making the sounds needed for winning full pulls are awesome, never been beat bench racing. but the cost of beer is high.
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Re: trivia time!! March 27, 2020 03:34PM
Not sure what xxx is talking about, But, I would still like to know about setting the engines to the left of the frame and other tricks to keep tractors on the straight and narrow!!
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