09:02:19am, Sunday, May 19, 2024
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old days
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Why is it that the goal was to pull a full pull @ 300ft? Now it seems it's a drag race to 330, 360, or higher. Are all of you seeing this? |
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Re: old days
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Dead Horse Beater
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Yep, it is called PROGRESS!
Fans love it. If you don't, there is a brush pull, or antique tractor pull near you to attend. You do know this is the 21st century, right? |
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Re: old days
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Progress?
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If that's the case, then why is the track at the NFMS still shorter that 300 feet? |
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Re: old days
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gee I wonder
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because just maybe the building is only 250 feet long. not really sure if that makes a difference. |
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Re: old days
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old school
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Not all fans like it I know don't. If I wanted to see speed it wouldn't be at a tractor pull. The 20 to 30 mph of a tractor pull is about the slowest motor sport around. Not to mention I was recently at a NTPA event and the 3 to 5 min between each hook is BS too or is that all in the name of progress? The fact is there is no school like the old school. |
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Re: old days
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JOHN
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Not everyone shares the same opinion,progressive thinkers still allow old school thoughts.I agree that the speed is new,but a slower pull with power required from the get go is still best,drop pan sleds are for the speed,I agree that fans like the show better,but they like blood and guts in hockey too,where do we draw the line? I have several tractors,some go fast,some go slow or fast,I enjoy both,but knocking the valve off a pressure cylinder is just that an accident waiting to happen,most runs at 30 mph are on the edge of being out of control. |
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Re: old days
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Kyle C
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I pull a NA Mini with a local Ohio club. For anyone who says speed is not.good for the pulling has it dead wrong. We always get more response out of pull with a fast sled than we do with a slower sled. It's the reason for the roll cages and skies and other safety equipment. We try to use Singer's mini sled when possible. For the sleds we run its the best around. On that sled we average above 30 mph on a run and even have been above 40 once and the winning hook was 318 feet. The people who say there is no skill on the first.part.of the run when you have little resistance I believe they are also wrong. You have to keep it straight and under control or the rest of the run is a waste. The pull is won or lost most of the time in the first 100 feet or so. The time you have for your reaction is so little on a fast sled compared to slower sled. On a fast sled once you come down on the throttle you better have your full focus on the run or you will be in trouble in a hurry.
Would also like to say I don't like runs over 330 or so. Most of the time this is not a problem. But it also depends on what sled you are running and the big one if the track is prepared out that far. Have seen a couple of times where a sled could not stop a tractor in 300 without making a tug pull. Adam Bauer at Canfield last year was a good example. All the weight was on the sled first stage dropped about 100 to 125 feet box topped around 220 and full hydraulic's was on at 240 feet and he still dragged it out past 350 and shut it off. |
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Re: old days
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funny
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But more fans love it.We need to put up a xmas tree and time the run |
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Re: old days
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Progress?
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Well then I guess maybe they need to update then because everyone seems to be ok with a tractor going 250 feet yet. No wait! |
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Re: old days
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Bs
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Nobody goes to a nascar race to watch the race. They go wanting to see a crash. You guys might be in denial tractor pulling is a form of entertament and the crowd likes horsepower, speed and danger. I wish the sled guys would figure out how to let us 60 and stop us. |
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Re: old days
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lewis
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There needs to be a set standerd you pull 300 or 340 all of the time not one night 300 the next night 340 on a 340ft track 6 thousand pound ss you can take a farm tractor out of the field and crawl to 270 or 280 so what are we pulling |
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Re: old days
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Im with them, I grew up during the era of 300 foot was full pull. The good sled operators had no problem setting up for that and made a good show. In a class of 10-15 tractors to have 2-3 in a pull off was great. Not like what happened at a pull this year with 20+, on a 320ft track, really?. I dont understand why someone would call it "progress" to have it 320-340 and beyond. Its a tractor PULL not a tractor drag race.
But thats me, call me Old Skool then........ |
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Re: old days
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Registered: 04/06/2008 Posts: 974 |
in my opinion certain classes like pro stock and lim pro need a long track. certainly pros I think make for a better show. The reason is these guys are putting so much power through 24.5 tires that they need to get hooked up. If the sled is set for say 280 or so they will buzz the tires the whole time and never hook up. more so this year than ever there is so much pedaling of the throttle for the first 40 or fifty feet to get them to hook up. the days of turning 6000 rpm on the line and letting the clutch out are gone. Technology has pushed the classes so far that driving has become such an important part of pulling. I would be interested to know what pullers thoughts are of 30.5 tires on pro stocks? |
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Re: old days
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old school
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If they put on 30s you might as well combine them with the supers and have 1 class. Also why don't they put on tires with a taller bar if they're burning them off? Not trying to be a smart a-- just asking. |
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Re: old days
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Registered: 07/14/2011 Posts: 59 |
Hi, First, let me say that I fall into the "old school" camp. But here are a few points to ponder... Yes, some fans like the "speed pulling" that we have now, but look at the old videos from the national events in the 1980s. 300 foot track. 1 or 2 make it out the end. Sometimes no one gets out. Speeds weren't that fast. BUT, look in the stands... Huge crowds of people that loved that style of pulling. And you can hear the crowds cheering like crazy when someone did make it out past 300. Progress? Not all progress is good, does anyone remember "New Coke"? Enough said... As for letting pullers go 340+ feet on a 300 foot track, it can actually hurt the "show" because there are few (if any) fans that are seated down that far. A sled operator once told me that his job was to "keep the show in front of the fans". It makes no sense to have the fan seating stop at 300 ft and then let all the pullers go 350. About driving and "hooking up out of the hole"; has anyone stopped to think that when the pan is actually coming off the ground during the first part of the pull that you are losing your hitch height? And that the tractors magically hook up at about the same point where the pan finally stays on the ground? Later ........ |
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Re: old days
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JOHN
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Same 0h same oh,every one wants the best of both worlds,show, power,pull fast and have it easy on equipment and good show for the fans,well life dictates what happens we just try to control it a little. When most tractors get past 300 ft.it is not a driver that makes it happen,getting off the line with 3000 plus hp and wheel speed of 100 mph it does take finesse and talent,also tons of luck and good fortune.The best names in the sport usually go the farthest,good set up and high hp and experience make that happen.I have watches and pulled for 30 plus yrs,have gone slow and 20 mph plus,both are a challenge,fast just requires more safety issues.More is not always better,new progressive electronics is wonderful,but at what "COST". There are no pure gains in this world,every one has an off setting opposite side. |
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Re: old days
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Registered: 07/14/2011 Posts: 59 |
Hi, To "WHAT": I'm sure if you stop and think about it, you will come to realize that if the pan is 12" in the air, the angle of the chain flattens out and you lose down force on the hitch; same as if the pan was on the ground and you dropped your hitch by 12"... To the overall discussion: If you look at all the posts, it's not really about slow vs fast; I think everyone would agree that speed and power increase the excitement, and the "old school" folks are not saying they want to go back to a stone boat and a 5 mph pace. I think what it really boils down to is about how the sleds are stopping the tractors. The old school way put more importance on the weight in the box and provide a more linear transfer of weight onto the pan. The new way is much less dependent on the weight box and more so on mechanical manipulation of the load on the pan. My opinion is that the sled designs evolved to try to keep up with the increases in the performance of the pulling vehicles, but that it may be time to grab a clean sheet of paper and come up with a sled design that puts the emphasis back on the weight box. And yes, I do believe that there are people in the pulling world who are smart enough to design a sled that is easy to get moving off the line, allows for some speed and excitement, and uses a more traditional system of weight transfer to stop the pulling vehicles. Later....... |
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Re: old days
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Fast puller
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It will take two trucks to haul the amount of weight to stop the classes if you just used the weight in the box. |
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Re: old days
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That's exactly the problem with the drop pan sled. They go 320+ feet, but in reality they're only pulling 220 because for the 1st 100 feet, they're basically towing a trailer. That's why guys have to feather the throttle because there's no load on the motor. That's why in the old days you'd see those 4000+ RPM clutch dumps on the line, there was a load on the whole time. There should be a load on the sled the entire length of the track, otherwise it's not pulling, it's drag racing. |
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Re: old days
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Well I am a fan of the old style of pulling. No drop pan and a 300 foot track. What was wrong with the classes they used to have. The 5,7,9 nd 12,000. Was good for pullers and most of them could run 2 and some of them would run 3 classes. Nothing would bring the fans to their feet more than a pulloff. If there was a 3 way pullof it was great.
Think about it 40 years latter people are still talking about tractors driven by Dean,Stengal Perry and Arfons. NTPA hasnt got any money from me in a long time and probably wont get any again! |
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Re: old days
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WHAT
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Re: old days
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Registered: 04/04/2008 Posts: 633 |
I have pulled the sleds in the Midwest mostly and on most of the tracks I have to drive my tractor out 50 or so feet and often go in the 320' range. When we go down to N.C. to pull the sled we use gives us a lot of hitch right at the start. That is fun but the problem becomes stopping us on the big end of the track. I often go 360' to 390'. When they let us get that good of a hole shot they can't stop us.
With the Lt. Unlimited tractors a lot of hitch out of the hole worked OK but with the RN mods...not so much although it was a fun ride,lay it over on the starting line hold on tight and hope you have enough fuel :-) . S'no Farmer |
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Re: old days
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speed=excitment
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The speed of the tractor going down the track at a fast rate is the only thing that tells the fan that the vehicle hooked to the sled has the power that four engines or a four turbo SS has. The sport does not do MPH or measurers the amount of the weight they pull, only how far they went. Therefore speed relates-translates to how far down the track you will pull the sled. If the sled goes 5 mph you might as well go to a antique hook. There is no way a slow sled is exciting to watch. And as far as the shows 30 years ago having more fans you are right. but it had nothing to do with the speed of the sled. All motor sports are in a decline, pulling included. NTPA tried a pace tractor and the fans hated it. High HP relates to high speed in every motor sport. |
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Re: old days
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I saw one of the pullers post that said the first 100 feet is like pulling a trailer. I see the same thing but I dont think that is bad, if you want to drive out at 5 mph go do I dont care. I can always use the time to get a beer or a snack. The speed is gonna be there if the puller has the power to get the sled moving. The old days the big mods were 12,000or 14,000 pounds and at 12,000 you have the weight to make the tire hook. Today the heavy tractors are 10,000 or 11,000 pounds if you had 1500hp you were one heck of a PS today if you have 1500hp you better get the tractor to run on the other 2 cylinders. Speed limits go back to stone boats when you had to have fat guys step on the sled to stop the tractor. Faster than 5 mph and the fat guys got tired and went home. Now I go home happy when the the weight box hits the top at 240 feet at 30mph . |
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