4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 10, 2016 03:46PM
Looking at building a 4020 Gas with a 341 for a NA class.
Looking for info on what needs to be done to make is setup work, have noticed in a few months of research that this type of setup doesn't get used much and curious to why
Class is 7500lb
412 cubic inch limit

I know IH would be ez but want to be different
Thanks in advance for info
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 10, 2016 05:29PM
Where's the 341 come from? Is that the cross flow Dubuque motor?

If it is, those manifolds are tiny.

Can you use a 4020 gas 404 cui motor.

What are the manifold rules?

Induction?

Can you use diesel block with gas head?

Can you use late model cng head?

More info would help here.
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 10, 2016 11:09PM
There really isn't a true 404 gas engine, at least not that I have ever found yet (from the factory). Some will argue that the 7700 combine came with one, I have yet to see a live one. My undestanding has been that the 7700 came with the 362 as the gas engine, but did have the larger throat zenith carb.

The 341 was the early 4020 gas engine, with the 362 being the later version, 1/4" on the stroke is the difference. It is not a Dubuque engine, not a cross flow head. The early block is referred to as the "wide" block (both gas and diesel, refers to the width at the deck/head and starts with the 4010 actually) and then '69 and later is the "narrow" block that was used right up to the 466 inception (which is essentially still the same block, has same stroke in diesel version, just bigger bore). This goes for both the gas and diesel blocks/heads, Deere did a nice job of using common engineering unlike IH which make has entirely different blocks for gas vs diesel. 4010 gas was 302 ci (smaller bore @ 4.00" but same stroke as 341), 380 ci diesel (same stroke as 404 diesel but smaller bore at 4.125"). These blocks are the same as early 4020 with the exception of being only a two bolt front mount vs 4 bolt when they went 4020, makes no real difference to anything.

To clarify:

4010
302 gas = 4.00" bore x 4.00" stroke
380 diesel = 4.125" bore x 4.75" stroke

4020 (pre 1969, "wide" bolck)
341 gas = 4.25" bore x 4.00" stoke
404 diesel = 4.25" bore x 4.75" stroke

4020 (post 1969, "narrow" block)
362 gas = 4.25" bore x 4.25" stroke
404 diesel = same bore and stoke as early

If you are able to, find a pre '69 404 diesel engine, and slap the gas head on it (from the 341), swap the gas pistons in (may require bushing the rod for smaller pin, or enlarging the pin bore in piston for diesel pin), bolt the gas head on and stuff the original gas distributor in where the Roosa pump is. There you have yourself a 404 gas engine. Same head gasket, same bolt pattern for gas or diesel head. Just don't try mix and match the wide/narrow blocks/heads, you will have trouble sealing the camshaft side (push rod area) of the block/head if you do.

As far as using the later CNG head (6076/6081), it is the same bolt pattern and will "bolt on", but the valve spacing doesn't work for the smaller 404 (4.25") bore size, the valves will hit the sleeves. I wouldn't advise notching the cast sleeves as you will find they will most likley crack and fail right away. The 341 (or 362) gas head will work good enough for the OE updraft carb anyways.

Hope this helps clear things up.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 08/11/2016 03:39AM by FarmersFun.
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 12, 2016 03:07PM
Will the 362 Gas head bolt up to the 380 cube diesel block? Is there any difference in propane equipment? Heads etc?
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 15, 2016 10:53PM
As discussed, the bolt pattern is the same, and the head gasket will seal around the cylinders and water jacket holes. I can't say with 100% confidence the oil gallery to the head is well aligned when trying this, it's been a while since I looked at them, you'd want to check that for sure. The other problem with putting the "narrow" head on the "wide" block is there is an area on the camshaft side of the block that will be open to the atmosphere (where the pushrods are). If you get creative, there may be a way to adequately seal for an NA engine application, have never tried. The propane versions were still the same head and cc size chamber (at least I'm prety darn sure), but I do know the pistons were different as the compression ratio went from 7.5:1 to 9.0:1 (again, I think those are the right numbers).
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 10, 2016 11:58PM
Call me! 563-543-7981
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 13, 2016 01:41AM
I have a 4020 gas head I'm about to scrap. Tried to sell it before, anyone interested?
Thanks, Matt.
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 15, 2016 01:01PM
Check 4010 on for sale page. This tractor is nice and the guy is a good person for you to talk to.
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 15, 2016 05:56PM
matt you coming to bg ????
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 15, 2016 10:55PM
Which engine is that head off of, Matt? 341 or 362?
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 16, 2016 12:26PM
Sorry, I have no idea. I do blue and red and it was on a pallet of IH heads I bought. I'll find the casting #, it was just tagged 4020 gas. Thanks
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 16, 2016 12:28PM
What do I look for on this head to tell?
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Re: 4020 Gas Pulling Tractor August 16, 2016 01:13PM
Casting number is likely the best, not remembering off hand if it is inside the valve cover area, or just on the top outside that area.

Going to BG so may be slow to respond on here.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/16/2016 01:15PM by FarmersFun.
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