Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 01:10AM
I am considering building a 10,000 lb hot farm tractor using a Case 504. General rules for class are 3" charger, water injection ok, 3,000 RPM Max, CI limit is 470 so would need to de-cube, however I cannot find very much information about best approach. I've seen several conversations about if putting in smaller piston the valves would not clear, but I don't have experience enough to know for sure. Does anyone have any good info on getting it down to >470, parts?

Also, I've always been a huge fan of the 70 series Case tractors, any recommendation on which model would be ideal for this class?
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 01:36AM
Just throwing it out, but they are a little tougher to come by - wouldn't it be easier to work with a 451? Smaller bore, same stroke.

We run a similar class here - 505ci, box turbo (2.8), any fuel pump, 3000 RPM, water is ok, 10,500lb and 20.8/38. Should be fun when we get it going - we run a 1370. Powershift problems...
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 02:47AM
Cdncase what kind of problems are you having with the powershift? Just can't handle the hp? Ideally I would like to find 8 speed but they're much harder than powershift.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 03:55AM
Quote
new guy
Cdncase what kind of problems are you having with the powershift? Just can't handle the hp? Ideally I would like to find 8 speed but they're much harder than powershift.

It wasn't great when we bought it. Now we're running a bit more fuel through it (P-pump), so it won't hold it. Working on an 8-speed solution.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/06/2018 03:55AM by CdnCase.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 01:49AM
Both Case engines [504 & 451] use a 5" stroke crankshaft. The difference is the piston diameter. So you could sleeve the 504 down to 4.466" = 469.95 cu. in. or put a bigger piston in the 451 block. You could also destroke the crankshaft to 4.663" + 470 cu.in., but i don't know if case crankshafts have enough material to do so. You could go with a 4.500" bore x 4.925" stroke = 470 cu.in. Also does the rules allow 1% over cu.in. for wear? if so you could bore the sleeves to 4.488". Only thing is, I'm not sure anyone makes a custom piston to any of these measurements. Just something to think about.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 02:41AM
Ok sounds like the easiest route may be to use 451 instead of 504. A while back someone told me there were advantages to the 504, but for the life of me I can’t remember what he said. Something to do with the heads maybe?
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 03:16AM
Look up case of chaos on facebook. Best running 3000rpm case in the country.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 04:02AM
Yes I've seen that tractor before and it sure is a sharp tractor. Does anyone know if that's a 504 or 451? I know the 1030's came factory with a 451 but figured a 504 swap is possible
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 04:14AM
The case of Chaos is a de cubes 504. There has been a lot of time and effort put into that tractor to get it to run with the red and green in the class. It can be done but it’s not easy or cheap.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 04:22AM
I figured getting a case to run with the red/green would not be an easy thing to do. I am glad to see it's doable though. Always been partial to the 30 and 70 series tractors
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 12:35PM
Have to agree with Levi on this. You need to talk with Allen Powell. Sweet running TRUE Case.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 07, 2018 08:01AM
I've been working on Case motors for over 30 years, you want the big journal block and crank! Then you have to put the head stud in the back so the back of block doesn't blow out. Then you have to address the idler issue, bigger bolt along with better hub . It's not always stroke gives you torque, air speed, exhaust speed, speed of injection, swirl in the head etc......
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 07, 2018 08:42AM
Better listen to jonesy, I was starting to think their weren’t to many who understood hp and torque production
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 05:06AM
why not use a 1030 rear, I know where two of those are as well as two 2090's with the 8 speed. The 1175 is an option but you have the big planetarys to deal with on those. There are a couple of them nearby. Let me know will give a price on any or all.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 06:00AM
451's have the smaller journal crankshaft like the 2090 504 has. Large journal 504's were in 2290, 2390, 2590. I don't think the 2290 has the oil spray to the bottom of the piston like the 23 and larger tractors. There's a few different variations of the 504, large journal, small journal, oil spray and depending on what series, pencil injectors or large body injectors. If you decubed a 504 by reducing the bore, maybe the sleeves could be notched to clear the valves, I'm not sure on that.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 08:16AM
I would use big journal block with skirt oilers and de stroke it. You'll want the bigger bore for bigger valves
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 11:19AM
in a 3000 rpm class torque is everything. stroke = torque id use a 451 with the 5.0 stroke and bore it to 470 then do the head work
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 12:29PM
Thanks for all the info guys. If I did go the route of boring the 451 does anyone know a builder with a good track record for 451 head work? Also will the pencil style injectors be a big issue?
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 01:14PM
Case of chaos we would be happy to build you a motor or sale a complete tractor ready to run Allen 502-817-6981
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 06, 2018 05:02PM
Go with a big journal 504 engine. Found on 1370 - 2670 & 2390 - 4690 probably on 2394 -4694.
I believe the crankshaft is about 50lbs. heavier than a small journal crank. I would think this would hold up better in the long run.
Also I believe the large journal 504 engine may be around 200 lbs. heavier as a long block, compared to a small journal engine.
The weights I am posting here are from an older Tractor Supply catalog, and my memory. I will try to dig this catalog out in the morning to verify these numbers ( I don't throw anything away, even though my wife would like to throw all my old magazines & catalogs away for me!)
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 07, 2018 11:45AM
I found this information in a CT Farm & Family catalog.
Short block weights.
1070-1170 = 840lbs.
1370-1570 = 1010lbs.

Crankshaft weights.
1370 = 180lbs.
1070 = 130lbs.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 07, 2018 01:47PM
Thanks for the info Jeff. Still not sure which route we’ll take as far as 451 vs 504. 451’s seem a lot easier to come by and de-cubing 504 looks to be quite the expensive project
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 07, 2018 09:18PM
Here’s something else to keep in mind: the 451 & the small journal 504 have a longer rod than the large journal 504. It’s half inch longer, the large journal 504 with a 10” rod is already plenty long. I would want to stick with the large journal.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 07, 2018 09:41PM
Take your time and do it right, if you want it cheap, look into another class.
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 08, 2018 03:00PM
I have a set of sleeves and pistons on my shelf to decube a 504 that fit the big rod and possibly a 1070 rear with 1/2 gears and billet input and needled diff with disc brakes and weld on hubs. 712-269-2851
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 08, 2018 12:40PM
Hey case of chaos can you build me a 540 motor?
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Re: Case 504/70 Series Hot Farm March 08, 2018 01:42PM
give me a call 2176536580
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