01:06:12am, Saturday, May 18, 2024
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3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
what do you guys think about a 3000 rpm, 600 C/I, 3x3 charger, open farm class? can run any pump, and any engine so long as engine made by maker of tractor. basically a performance based set of rules instead of all the stuff about pto, hydraulics etc... |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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deere puller9
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I think that you have two ways you can go with a new class. I see in other posts that you are trying to fit old tractors in so that is a factor, however the right new 3000 class will bring out a bunch of new tractors. One thing is that you should decide on some safety things before you start the class, if done right they might want a cage or rops.
Class 1. 466 cid, 10 mil A-pump, stock 3LM charger, no water injection, 3000 rpms, 20.8 non cut tires great class with a lot of tractors, can turn into a red/green show, should open it up to 505 cubes Very affordable and with the right guy you can make a lot of power. A strong tractor can run road gear in this class up to about 10500 lbs. This is a very fun, very competative class. Problem with this class is there is a lot to check and nobody want to be the tech guy. other option Class 2. Only two main rules. Turbo and 3000 rpm (3LM or HX 50 or Holset) Everybody runs the same out of the box turbo. If you limit the turbo size the cubic inches won't make as big of a difference. A 3LM won't let a 600+ motor breath. This means all that you tech is the rpms and the turbo. IF you get a holset with a 2.75 it will wake up the class a lot. The smaller the limit on the turbo, the better chance a small cube tractor has at competing (for the guy just starting out that doesn't want to break the bank) Run cut tires, water injection. Great thing about this class run the tractor over the scale, check the drawbar, look at the turbo, hook up the monitor on the sled for rpms and hand out the trophy. Nobody can bit*h |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
coincidentally, we actually recommended two classes nearly identical to what you suggest. the reason being that our class we run now has basic entry tractors in it with 3lm's and no cuts and they compete against tractors with larger cubes, up to and including a 3x3 chargers. so we wanted to break it out some to let more people compete. we are trying to get it right but have to take into account many tractors we already have and also the main thing keep it open enough to cover most all tractors so we don't turn people away |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 03/31/2008 Posts: 762 |
I understand what you are trying to do, but be carefull trying to be all inclusive. After a couple of years it's likely everyone will be at or close to the rule limits because they think that is what keeps them from winning. Those who can't or don't want to build up will quit. The point is if you have a bunch @ 505 & a couple @ 600 the 505 limit may be best in the long run if few of the 505 can/will build up to 600. |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
good point. I think that your point makes a good arguement for having two classes. a 466 or 505 class with 3lm and a second class at 600 with say a hx50 or a 3x3. that way most bases are covered. I know there will always be someone bitc*ing about something but try to get reasonable rules and I think most will follow along ok. There seems to be a significant number of Hot tractors that fit in a 3000 rpm hot class with bigger cubes, they are way more than a turned up farm tractor but way less than a limited pro. hoping to keep things basically more like tractors at the county farm pull but recognize they are definitley hot. |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Posts: 756 |
the more rules there are the less fun it is |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
You got that right!!!! trying to keep it simple. looks like we may have a consensus and will move forward. will be cool to see some of the tractors running. will be like the old days when you used to see 7-8 brands instead of just red and green |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Anonymous User
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okay i agree with gonzo and you bill but however.... the thought of a 619 block punched out fears everyone.... v8 cat 3208 636 cubers are pretty serious with the right turbo....... the fact is if we all had the same amount of money and the parts for each tractor cost the same and we all had the same ambitions rules would become un needed...... but none of these are actually facts there fore rules become required to keep everyone in a parameter set system...which also causes better competition and.....with the right rules.....a great show that is fair.....cubes mean nothing once the turbo limit perspective comes into play...well at least not as much... you can only burn what you can fedd there fore....its lets them all play or we gotta sit donw and devise these rules |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
Rickmo, in speaking with steve it looks like a consensus may me coming into view with 600 ci, 3x3, and "A" pump. that is a nice class I think. Probably not quite as reliable & economical with the A but still way better than holding the rotory guys to a rotory. I think you guys are going to be surprised at how many tractors will be competitive in this class and just how many new ones will show up. like I said, it will be like the old days with Orange red, green, blue, white, case, who knows.. happy to see it happening and hope all goes as we have discussed. I agree the really big cube 6030's are a animal in themselves, but we should make every effort to make a place for them. maybe no limit on cubes above 11,500 or something would be my suggestion |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Anonymous User
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i agree bill let them the big cube tractors play but keep them heavier and not in the "466" region playground let the big cube guys play with each other basically |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Anonymous User
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sorry for double posting ... but also yeah letting the guys have pump options makes it so motor work and fine tuning are more of a ploy yes i meant ploy then pure pump differences.... level the field one the fuel side ....and turbos level the field on the air side......... sonds good lets combust it and play balll lmao.!!!!!! |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Future PA SF Puller
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Bill I think your profarm rules sound like a nice stepping stone into the current super farm class that is run in western pa. If you would go with 3000rpm, 600cui, and 3x3 some tractors could probably transition into that class nicely. Also those proposed rules seem very similar to Badger state profarm and those tractors flat out run! |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Profarm2
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we run a 3X3.7 charger intercoolers and single port water injection. 3000 RPMs and 640 ci. we also run 466 in the same class. we all run anywhere between 1 tooth and 3 teeth over road gear. |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
wow. that is gettin it down the track. we are just approaching road gear. Are you running road gear with torque out and 1-3 over and finishing like that at a 3000 rpm limit? |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Profarm2
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we ran 2 over on the high side of the torque. we do have to pull it but it will spin in on the low side and can get back to 3000 RPMS. Next year we are putting 3 over in and will be able to hack it. and we are only running a 466 |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
I see you a future pa puller, are you going to be in the western side of the state? we are always looking for new pullers. would be nice to have you try out our pulls in you are in the area. |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Future PA Super Farm Puller
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Yes in the western part of PA. Putting a 640IH together to run super farm against the lim pro with USA and PPL. No good super farms in the class that I know of, maybe we can shake up the lim pro tractors a bit. Time will tell. If your rules fit I just may try to run a little to get started. |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
it would be great to have you down this way. the website will be updated sometine during the next few months once the rules are decided and dates set. steelcitypullers.com right now we have an altered class which kind of covers everything outside the 3000 rpm classes. |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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first of all your 4240 syncro doesnt run near as good as it should , from what i have read these other boys are running a much faster gear already second maybe you should have waited till the class rules were set before you bought a 600 inch motor , third everyone at steel city pullers knows you dont ,wont , cant run 3000 rpms ,and when you get caught you wine like a little girl and throw a temper tantram scattering weights all over the fairgrounds and finally who died and made you the spokesperson ? |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
Wow, apparently you have an axe to grind and some homework to do. no one died that I am aware of and I am not the spokesperson. I am just volunteering to help set some guidelines that will make the pull more fun for everyone. If it was not solicited, I would not be offering. Some folks prefer to complain anonymously after they get beat, and stop going with some lame excuse to cover the real reason instead of stepping forward to help make things better for all. I mean you hardly even ever go, so why are you so concerned anyhow? I don't always win, but I don't cry about it and try to get people ejected. Get involved, build a tractor to compete ( a 4320 should do the trick) or maybe just stick with your Putt Putt or better yet just let it go, instead of making yourself look like a whining idiot. I expected more class from you than that... come on dude, Man up and get with the program. Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2009 01:24AM by Bill R.. |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Anonymous User
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Wow mmg900 you really got an attitude.... i mean what are you doing for steel city...... not much obviously other than complaining....... at least billy is helping and striving to help steelcity become a more mainstream and fan plausible pulling series........ the guys rpm and obviously billy's not cheating....... so unless your gonna help or say something nice..... just go post elswhere and continue to post anonmously......
thanks )>>>>>>>) OliverGuys |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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He went ahead and printed up his own rules for (Bills new 600 class) and handed them out at the last steel city gathering and he didnt even show these new rules to the steel city board members. |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
LOL.. you crack me up. if you read them, it said right on top my suggestion.. just trying to help level the field some. I will run whatever the board decides and not post personal attacks anonymously on pull off. if no body gives an opinion how will we ever get better rules? or how will the boaard know what the pullers want. I mean Judd, why do you find it necessary to say dumb @#$%& like that. Do you think I am trying to sabatoge the club or something? damn I am just trying to help out. what is wrong with the rules I suggest? don't they help everyone out?oh, and by the way. Since you were not there at the fundraiser or any other of the fund raisers they have had, you probably didn't know that I handed the rule recommendations TO the board members personally and no one else. Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2009 03:11AM by Bill R.. |
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Re: ok, lets clarify some stuff here
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
1st. this is a post trying to solicit Ideas from other people (read guys who pull) about what they think would be a good idea for rule changes. 2nd. it is to try to open up the class some to economy hot tractors. maybe we can get a D21 with an A pump or a 4010 with an A pump in there. they are so much easier and cheaper to build and lots of guys have them in the sheds waiting to turn them into a project. 3rd. stop thinking that everything someone does is because of self interest. Think for a moment it is possible that some one is not so selfish as to prevent them from making a suggestion that doesn not actually only benefit them. People are generally good you know. especially farm folks. 4rth. if you have a good suggestion, then make it! people will read and think about it, even if turns out they do not use it at least you know you tried. 5th. I know I have personally had nothing but nice good old conversation and compliments on both Rodneys and your tractor Judd, so why in hell do you feel I am trying screw you guys over or something. I mean WTF over? Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2009 02:59AM by Bill R.. |
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Re: ok, lets clarify some stuff here
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YOU NEED TO CONTROL INLET AND OUTLET SIZE ON THE CHARGERS. MAKE SURE HEADS ARE STOCK . A PUIMP LIMIT . MANIFOLDS STOCK AND 3000 RPM ,THAT SHOULD TAKE CARE OF ALL PROBLEMS . AND ONLY 1 FUEL #2 DEISEL TRY THAT AND SEE IF IT WORKS , MAYBE A BOX CHARGER MIGHT HELP |
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Re: you're gonna have it
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SCPuller2
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Bill R. I thought all you green guys over in 84 stuck together! guess not??? Isn't MMg900 Rodney Yates and ole ZZTop Judd Ashby who chipped in above with the worhtless smart ass stuff. He's the one you soled the 466 combine moter to put in the 4440 that Brian has, so Judd could keep his stoker moter right? Thought thats who he was anyhow. Anyway, all the clubs have guys who do nothing but complain especially when the work comes. Hope you don't let them get under your skin and stop you from trying to make the sc pullers better. |
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Re: you're gonna have it
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
LOL, yeah apparently not.. No big deal, some folks never happy with anything even if it does not affect them. I am confident the club board will listen to suggestions make good choices for the pullers. By the way, those suggestions are from several of the guys on the board. I know Steve talks to most all the guys while trucking and I just put it on paper to make it presentable. They are not all my ideas or (Bills Class) as one put it. In fact, most are a compromise of what are the guys discussed. At any rate those guys have never done anything for the club and their comments don't take any hair off my A**. Time to put the school girl chatter in the shi*can and move on.... |
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Re: you're gonna have it
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Anonymous User
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i agree bill... you do the research and put the facts on paper basically you have a grasp on the parameters and you presented them to the board if they listen or not you cant cntrol ...but we can just deal with the out come...lol...ps im pullin for the new class |
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Re: you're gonna have it
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Anonymous User
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i would also say that this is a bt ridiculous are we all 12 cause this is based around a pullng associtation... you knew where to go if you have a bitch and ythats def not here...... so let the ppl willng to gather info and make things better be... @#$%&!!!!!!!!!!!...and that refers to all that it offends |
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Re: you're gonna have it
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I am so glad that one statement caused so much controversy! The facts of this matters are simple, everyone wants it their way and it just cant happen . unless you put some kind of electric rpm moniter on the tractor the same crap continues , and as far as the cube rule goes , who is going to police this how are you going to check it, and , when ? Yes , i maybe the A___ hole in this case but i accomplished more more in one statement than has happened all summer . It is important to me that this club not only survives , but thrives . Their is a need for seperation with some of these tractors , it needs to happen now, right now while everyone is active and talking about it !!!! KEEP TALKING ,ARGUING,A GOOD STIR OF THE POT,WHATEVER IT TAKES. I really like the east coast rules,and i really like the rules used at mechanicstown ,either one would invite others to the pull .
PS Maybe we could add a few more classes so the sun will be up when we go home ! |
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Re: you're gonna have it
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
let me get this straight.. You're saying ...I'm so glad my one statement caused so much controversy and YOU accomplished more with that than happened all summer.... Lets just review that just a second..
You said in that one statement .. Billy's tractor does not run as good as it should, Billy is a cheater, Billy cries when caught and has a temper, and is not the spokesmen for the club... Well, I am just not seeing the value added suggestions in that statement for the club or any mention of rule changes or suggestions. and now you are so happy for yourself !!! Guess what will really make you feel good... Be a Christian and be a man and stick your hand out for a handshake and offer an apology. and next time give somebody a chance before passing judgement. Think back for a minute if you can... maybe you were not there. I made the God awful mistake of losing my temper in front people at the pull (4 years ago) and in a week or two after that happened, I stood up in front of who were there and made my apology and stuck my hand out... and... in the end, it looks like most of the stuff that many of the board members and pullers have been discussing throughout the season and especially in last few weeks did come to pass today and will be great changes for the club. And I can honestly say that I do feel good for the results and that I am happy to have had a part in making some of it happen, inspite of some who could not and would not trust my intentions, and the others who on top of that felt it was necessary to personally attack me as well. You may not remember I Tached in OK before they said I was 43 rpm over on the way out and I did not change anything on my tractor. I met the rules way back when, I met the rules this year, I will meet the rules next year too, electronics or not... you did have one good point... my tractor does not run as good as it should, so I will be fixing that for next year... or keep trying at least... |
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Re: you're gonna have it
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Profarm2
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I like the rules you guys have for the profarm class but not sure if you guys have enough. I would be able to come out there and run our 3X3.5 charger as well as our water injection and intercooler. |
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Re: you're gonna have it
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
would be nice to see some new faces, so if you meet the rules come on over. I will be running in the hot farm 3000 rpm class. I know we definitlety have some tuning to do on the rules, but they are a heck of a lot better than what we had before. that was the reason for ths thread in the first place and we made some headway. appreciate all the input from you and the others on the thread. . |
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Re: you're gonna have it
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Profarm2
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i do make the rules but i am from Illinois and that would be to far of a haul to make any hooks. but it sounds like you have a great start to a class. Good luck to you guys and the new class. |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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farmgirl
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I'd just like to say MMG900 you're rude!! I think Bill puts on a good show and has some good ideas as far as Steel City Pullers is concerned. MORE MEN should be forth coming with ideas and suggestions themselves instead of all the crying and name calling. |
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Re: 3000 rpm class rules?
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yup
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I would say the mmg900, (well the mmg900 tells most of use the problems this guy has from the start). Maybe find a beter shade of paint to start with, this may cut down on your insecurity problems. |
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Re: Yup
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Registered: 01/17/2009 Posts: 207 |
Hey yup, there`s nothing wrong with MM except the heads, 4 main bearings, oil system, no sleeves, long studs for the blocks and heads, only made 1 DI diesel motor, etc...LOL. All has a fix if you have deep pockets. |
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Re: Yup
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MM fan
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But you gotta admit- if you want N/A big cubes, MM is the way to go.....except for the heads, and the fact that everything on a MM weighs twice what it needs to...... |
Re: Yup
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Registered: 01/17/2009 Posts: 207 |
Yep,forgot the weight and the pistons that weigh as much as a VW bug.
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Re: Yup
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Profarm2
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the MM Wapum Minimo out of Wis. runs really well in the Light Super class. |
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Re: Yup
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Registered: 01/17/2009 Posts: 207 |
Yes it does, tere is lots of work on his and Aaron`s tractor to get them to stay together. Crankshaft and crankcase is true Moline, everything else is modified. Got to love the MM `s . They are really nice people to talk to. |
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finally
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Anonymous User
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Well i can finally put an end to this subject on the steel city pullers end of thing..for this year at least..... check out www.steelcitypullers.org rules are up and finalized.... also for you minnie mo guys who were posting check out oliverguys.webs.com good site you'll enjoy |
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Re: finally
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Registered: 05/05/2008 Posts: 124 |
Nice job on the new site. |
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