06:36:03am, Saturday, April 27, 2024
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Light PS and Light SF
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
The thread below is getting a little long...
Here’s my revised rules for a Lightweight Pro Stock class. I tried to incorporate most of the ideas that people suggested. I think this class would be a blast to watch, and I think it would be a very interesting class to build a tractor for. Again, this is not a cheap class (see Light Super Farm below for a limited alternative), but I think it would very quickly become a fan favorite. Lightweight Pro Stock Division:
Lightweight Super Farm Division: Here’s are my proposed rules for those that want a little tamer class at a reasonable cubic inch limit. I call the class Light Super Farm, but there are some minor changes from the Super Farm class.
An additional change from the current Super Farm class is the manifolds. I think allowing pullers and builders some creativity will make for some interesting options. Sure you can run a marine manifold of a bulldozer manifold, but you can also build a manifold in whatever design you'd like. Last but not least in the Light Super Farm is the chassis change. I think it’s important to find a way to keep new tractors coming into the class. I think allowing competitors to remove the transmission and clutch housings, while still running a stock rear-end would be a great compromise to help create a starter class that still keeps more of the tractor in the class, while also allowing new tractors a chance to make weight. I really think these two classes would cater to just about every brand of tractor. Both classes would fill a much needed niche in the sport, and both classes would quickly be fan favorites. I'd love to see both these classes adopted at some point. I’m sure I missed something in my ideas, please feel free to add or make suggestions. Jake Morgan Owner, PULLOFF.COM Independent Pulling News This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated. Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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jake, as a hot stock puller in the northeast these two classes excite me especcially the lsf. i feel i could build a competetive tractor and not break the bank doing it. if nytpa or empire picked up either class it would explode w/ tractors in the first year.thanks dave |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Posts: 590 |
Jake, here in the midwest, I think one would see a lot of the local Hot Farm tractors make a few alterations & jump up into the light SuperFarm class. That one I think would take off like wildfire! |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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wondering
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Jake I d like both classes I just don't liek the over head cam on the Lt. PS class, which class do you think will start first and which one will have more tractors in 5 years. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Registered: 03/27/2008 Posts: 1,145 |
Hi!
While I not like the billet head idea (the 4 valves get decubing here) - I guess that is up to you folks to figure it out. What I would think would help to get it started, is to start it as one class under the rules of the "open" and by the time you have enough tractors, you can still split it on the higher levels. Running a stock head with an under 4 inch charger (a typical HX80) with a 13mm P is not breaking the bank, but running well enough to put on a show together with the top guys. Important is to get it started first and make it grow. Then you can think about the "entry level"... Here is a little video of the dutch B-league which has a lot of tractors with P-Pumps, with less than 500 cui and "not so expensive" Turbos. That white 66 Inter and the red Magnum have Sigmas... Floating Finish - the German Tractor Pulling Web Show and EU Live Streams: [www.youtube.com] Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/25/2009 04:13AM by Sascha. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Registered: 03/26/2008 Posts: 256 |
A class like in the vidio would never work here it was over half Ford/NewHolland |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
Just curious… why don't you like the overhead cam on stock heads in Light Pro Stock? If it comes from the factory that way shouldn't you be able to run your stock head?
I think the Light Super Farm would grow extremely quickly; there are already a ton of tractors that are close to these limits. ORVTPA and Missouri are already running something similar. I think the rules I came up with would allow all those tractors to pull in a Light Super Farm class tomorrow. The Light Pro Stock would take more time just because it’s a more expensive class. In 5-10 years the Light Pro would just be awesome to watch. As they say, good things come to those who wait. Jake Morgan Owner, PULLOFF.COM Independent Pulling News This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated. Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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puller 12222
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All you need for this to happen ( 510 cid pro's) is 8 or 10 people to spend $ 50,000- $100,000 k each (preferably in the same sancitioning body) then have a sanctioning body to pick up the class, and a half dozen promotors agree to run a class with only 8-10 tractors existing in the country, |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Anonymous User
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----De-cubing of larger engines is allowed----
Not Good idea, for more coller on the track,,, take the biggest possible engine, de-cubing th engine ( less stroke and big bore) you make manny rpm,,, and big valve's,,,, not fair,, i think. Take 510 Max Stock engines,,, al the coller have them,,, and make them compitatif,,, IH, Cummins,John Deere, Agco, Cat, Deutz, Sisu-diesel Valtra , Perkins V8,, Zetor, Ursus, Newholland,,,, and manny more,,, |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Anonymous User
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Who do you think might be the first to adopt such rules? Would it be NTPA, PPL, ....or will it take a new organization to start these type rules? Or would it start at the state, regional level.
Jake, you are very close on your rules, these would be two great classes. Notice the common theme ;510ci. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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IH SF Puller
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No good comes from a class that start with limited or light. What is so wrong with the way the rules are now? Why do people that don't pull feel the need to dictate how people that do pull spend their money. Lets make every class light enough that you can put it on a care hauler behind your mini van. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
First, ALL classes are limited! Even the Unlimited Mod and Unlimited Super Stock are limited classes. Don’t let their names fool you.
Second, a 510 cubic inch class would allow for all colors to be competitive, and not cater to just a couple of manufacturers. How many Ford Pro Stocks do you see? Not too many! Why...? How many Ford tractors do you see in the “Light or Limited” classes? TOO MANY! (Just kidding Ford guys!) If you truly don’t understand why limiting the cubic inches is good for color I’d suggest you go to Cloverdale, IN for the 2009 Hoosier Invitational (look for a flyer on the main page later today). If you can’t see it after watching some of the limited classes at that event you’ll never get it. Third, a light class can put on a great show. They can be right on the edge of not having enough front end weight. In a light class balance is much more difficult to attain because you have less movable weight to work with. Therefore the lighter the tractor the less room there is for error on setup. Light classes are classes the showcase setup and driving. It has absolutely nothing to do with hauling your tractor to the event! "Why do people that don't pull feel the need to dictate how people that do pull spend their money" People that don't pull tractors are called FANS! It continues to amaze me that some pullers don't care what fans want. The fans opinion means nothing to them. Of course they love it when they have fans and people are saying nice thing about their tractor, but when fans don’t like something the puller is outraged. Fans, not only have a right to have a voice, but need a voice. With that attitude it’s no surprise that pulling doesn’t have many fans! Jake Morgan Owner, PULLOFF.COM Independent Pulling News This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated. Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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YES!
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Both of these classes would strengthen an organization... and I'd love to see the NTPA offer them.
In the Lt. Pro class, do you think there's any risk in a big cube motor (decubed) having an unfair advantage? Or does the "stock manufactures' block" rule eliminate that concern? With the Lt. SF class the Restrictor Tube seems like a simple and cost effective way to regulate the turbo. Is there a specific reason why you think the length of the tube should be 12''? The NTPA used a 3" (maybe it was 4"?) tube with their original version of the Limited Pro class. With a specific size "smooth bore" turbo spec do you think something bigger than a 3x4 would be even better? No doubt, a 3x4 spec would work well... but a 3.6 spec may add value without creating an additional cost and reliability burden.? The Lt. Super Farm name seems logical (because the rules you're proposing are very similiar to SF). Though, calling the class Lt. Limited Pro would work too. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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concerned
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I really like both classes, but I,m not sure if the Lite Super Farm class is a good idea about using the stock rearend and stuff. I think that there mite be to much grinding to get the weight down and it will be a safety isue. Full rails should be mandatery for the class if you go to low on the wieght and still try and use the stock parts. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 2,526 |
I understand your concern, but AC, JD, IH, Ford/NH all easily made the 7500 lb. Super Stock. Most had four turbos and still had plenty of movable weight. Yes some aluminum parts will need to be used to lighten the tractor up, but that’s been happening in this sport for years and years. Sure there may be a little cutting and grinding, but that’s also part of taking a stock chassis and using it for pulling.
I’ve actually seen all those chassis lightened up and run in a 5500lb Super Stock class. That’s when the grinding really gets done. I don’t think 7500 lbs.-8000 lbs. would necessitate too much grinding on most castings. Jake Morgan Owner, PULLOFF.COM Independent Pulling News This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated. Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Jay F
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How man classes can the sport support? |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Anonymous User
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Another idea for a new national class would be to use the east coast limited pro rules. They seem to work well and it is a great class. Besides the rules are established and their are already a bunch of tractors.
540ci OEM head A-pump Any charger 8500 lbs. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Anonymous User
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I would really be in on building a light limited super farm as I'm already building a 505ci motor for my hot farm for next season. |
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Re: Light PS and Light SF
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Registered: 12/19/2008 Posts: 90 |
Jake, they both sound like a good idea. Sounds like some dont want any more color cause they might get beat. |
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- BREAK -
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Registered: 03/27/2008 Posts: 1,145 |
Looks like there is enough interest to try to get it started.
Time to start being creative and laying out a plan on how to get this to actually WORK. Bullshitting and Talking on the forum is one thing (and the most easy one). Getting the stuff on the track is 98% of the job that would need to get done. Suggestion: Who already has a tractor with: less than 510 cui that can spin more than a 3 inch charger ways 8000 lbs or less has certified rollcage, blanket, clutch, .... If more than 10 have it - Get together and try to sell that package to Gordyville. Forget about how you'd place and what might be fair for the first two years - just try to put on a good show TOGETHER and see how the fans react (promotors will be watching, too). Maybe even do it together with the East Coast guys who run the A pump with 540 cui. I remember back when Forresters came here to watch like 4 or 5 years ago, the diffrences in gear ratio between those two was marginal. The open pump / open turbo guys will pass the A pump guys in a short while - but for a start you could join forces. Floating Finish - the German Tractor Pulling Web Show and EU Live Streams: [www.youtube.com] Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/28/2009 07:47AM by Sascha. |
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