04:55:12am, Monday, April 29, 2024
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LLSS
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MR.THINKER
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I know the virus is eveyones main concern right now but it might do us some good to take our mind off of it for a bit.
When will we start seeing LLSS in the Enderle Pull Off? I think with the open SS disappearing in NTPA its finally time to bump up LLSS into some bigger events. If Lt Pro and Ltd Pro are getting to pull at big events like tomah and nfms its time for LLSS to join them. Bring back the varieties of color, model, and engine configuration that the 5500 super stock class did in the 80's. MAKE PULLING GREAT AGAIN! |
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Re: LLSS
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Agreed
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I agree LLSS are well worthy to be seen at national pulls. And i do like your comparison between llss and the old 5500 super stock. I hope to see them at tomah and bowling green soon! |
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Re: LLSS
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Posts: 1,161 |
The LLSS class was added as a regional class for 2020, but no events have made added it as regional. Rules have been put together by the WTPA and HSTPA putting their input in as they are the only two state organizations running the class. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
PPL also runs this class in the Western Series. It's to bad that these two organizations can't get together and have the same rules. |
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Re: LLSS
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Festus Haggin
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That means 6250lbs, that will keep some away, 6000lbs is plenty, PPL ran them at 6000 with mid-south an it worked out great, but go ahead an run it - an 8 or 10 tractor class could be a 25, --- funny how people dont look history an see what works -- Brandenburg, Ky is prime example -- always at least 20 tractors and been as many as 30 --- an both fuels an 6000lbs an very competitive. |
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Re: LLSS
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Light and limited pros also cost a heck of a lot more than your standard llss. Some classes are meant to stay at the state/regional level. |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
I think are class is a stepping stone to the LLS class . Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/16/2020 10:17AM by David Runkle(earls dream). |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 01/10/2016 Posts: 183 |
I built to met WTPA rules so I would like to keep them. Now if I would loose some weight it would help. The class is a great mix of tractors. |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 04/04/2008 Posts: 1,522 |
If this class cant come together over 250 lbs that's assinine..split the difference 6125..j-c compromise to do this |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
What's funny is that there's tractors from the south the come to Gordyville and Cowtown pull and run 6400 and have no problems with weight . I think if you what this class to pull at big events the weight needs to stay at 6250. |
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Re: LLSS
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Festus Haggin
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You know whats funnier , theres tractors that run down south that can ALL make 6000lbs an have 4 or 5 hundred lbs moveable weight that are 66 series IHs, 4010 JDs, American Beauty can make weight and its a big case,why can't you northern guys? |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
This is one of the reasons why our class will never get a regional or national event because people can't compromise. if the guys up north and the guys down south I can't find common ground to move this class forward, we need to meet in middle . |
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Re: LLSS
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Still wondering
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Have always wondered how the guys in the south can get so lite and no one else can...it’s just easier to give them 250-500lbs I guess |
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Re: LLSS
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Futuristic
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Im sure if tomah, bowling green, or nfms had LLSS that 250lbs wouldn't matter, people are going to shut up and just set their tractors up to the class. The main problem is just getting the promoter to hire the class... but i see that changing in the near future. Get them LLSS built up boys and girls!! |
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Re: LLSS
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Posts: 1,161 |
Exactly, the WTPA guys wanted 6,250lbs while HSTPA wanted 6,000lbs. HSTPA wanted to allow the 3.4x4 smooth bore turbo and WTPA wanted to keep it at 3x4 slotted. What did they end up doing? They meet in the middle and went with 6,250lbs with max turbo size of 3.4x4 smooth bore. If this class wants to be involved in bigger events then some common set of rules need to be established and not have every organization run their own rules. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: LLSS
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Festus Haggin
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Way more expensive to allow the turbo than weight, so is everyone going to go buy a charger now " should never have happened ", BIG MISTAKE !!!! |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 10/02/2009 Posts: 39 |
mr. anderson then its you northern guys choice not to run those rules. I had been out of the class for nearly 10 years, had nothing to do with what rules where made. actually the turbo rule when i came back was smallest it had been in many years. I built a tractor to rules that where in place so I damn sure didnt take advantage of nothing. everyone told me the 410, slotted charger with cooler would make more power, maybe it does I havnt been on dyno. why are you all so worried about the southern rules. If you dont like it dont run our rules. we have good numbers here and it works. If your rules work for you guys then fine. I dont see why we need same rules. I also dont think the class needs to be a national class. it would just hurt numbers for the state groups |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 01/04/2012 Posts: 156 |
hey travis , just to clarify , A. I know the rules were there when you built ,,,,, so cant blame you for takin advantage , B. I don't think it needs to be a national class either . I was chiming in on the growth rate ,,,,, and I don't understand the 28% difference in cubic in …….could I guy build a coal powered pro stock at 870 cubic inches ???? |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 10/02/2009 Posts: 39 |
rules in Ky been 470 since class started in late 90s I think. The 410 didnt come along here till few years back. yea we have cube advantage but 410 has slot and cooler advantage. I didnt want to mess with cooler. personal preference. |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/18/2018 Posts: 244 |
I'd rather watch a class of Farm Stock over LLSS..... |
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Re: LLSS
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LEWIS
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Meeting in the middle is exactly how all these classes get screwed up meeting in the middle weight next it will be ,turbos ,cubic inches rear ends and so on.Turbos was met in the middle for a little while se what happened there give the big money spenders that extra weight and just se what happens |
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Re: LLSS
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HSTPA PULLER
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Wtpa and hstpa and IPL puller have a good set of rules and if you went to come and pull with us you are welcome Ntpa region 2 has some pulls also |
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Re: LLSS
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?
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Really, huh, ive watched the YouTube videos an theres usually only about 5 or 6 thats there, maybe 7 or 8 on a good night, if your rules are so great then why aren't they more tractors, watch any of the videos from down south ( BOB- KTPA-TNT- ) and there will be 3 times the tractors in the class than the guys up north !!!! Just Sayn !!! Truth is Truth : PS- dont hate the messenger just the message !!! |
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Re: LLSS
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Posts: 1,161 |
That's cause WTPA is going into it's 4th year and HSTPA is going into it's 2nd I believe. Down south the class has been strong for nearly a decade. It's growing in popularity up north so give it some time. WTPA could have roughly 12 tractors running for points with up to 15 or more tractors at some events. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: LLSS
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?
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Huh-- John Anderson only been pulling four yrs,really, Hawthorne been pulling alot longer than four yrs, Denny Frye was pulling along time ago, Speigleburgs were pulling langer than four yrs ago in the LLSS, Engleking was pulling way back in the early 2000s, do i need to go on-- the LLSS class has been around in Wisconsin longer than 4 yrs, now I'll give you credit on Hoosier State but im not buying it in Wisconsin !!!! |
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Re: LLSS
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?
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And another thing, if what you say is true - ( that WTPA has only been around 4yrs ) how do you know their rules are the best for the LLSS class? Apparently it works in the south cause YOU said its been around for a decade, hum, must have done something right, its still going strong and gaining traction every day !!! |
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Re: LLSS
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Posts: 1,161 |
I never said that WTPA started the LLSS class. WTPA become a points class in 2016. I don't know when BSTP started the LLSS class, but it was before WTPA. Spiegelbergs, along with Mikkelson's and a couple others, helped kickstart the class in Wisconsin. Again, I also never said that WTPA rules are the best rules. The Wisconsin LLSS class, whether WTPA, BSTP, or any other local organization, is growing also. I only mentioned WTPA and HSTPA with the rules as they are the ONLY state organizations for NTPA that run the LLSS class. If Mid-South didn't go PPL, then they too could have been at the meeting to discuss the rules. Unfortunately, they are not and they will have to run the rules agreed upon if they want to run any region events with NTPA. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
WTPA started there class 4 years ago , BSTP started in 1997 . Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/17/2020 01:00AM by David Runkle(earls dream). |
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Re: LLSS
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Futuristic
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It doesn't matter if these different clubs have different rules because if tomah has WTPA LLSS, guess what if you're pulling a LLSS in a different club I'm very sure that you are going to do what it takes to pull at such of a great event. The super farms do it for an example. |
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Re: LLSS
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?
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Your probably right, there would be several load an go !!! |
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Re: LLSS
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WI puller
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If Badger State Pullers get their LLSS at Hillsboro or Mackville then I'm sure other LLSS tractors from different clubs and states will make their tractors fit the rules too. Theres no need to argue over the rules and LLSS is in better shape than what most people think. Be prepared to start seeing this class at bigger events, it will be nice to see a class like 5500 super stock back at bigger events again! |
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Re: LLSS
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?
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I hope your right, i love the class, i think it'll become a Regional class within the next couple yrs.It just amazes me that everyone thinks that the northern rules are best an everyone should change to their rules when obviously the rules down south have worked longer with way more participants, so why should they change something thats been working instead of the guys up north changing to whats apparently more popular by the amount of tractors at every event !! That just seems like a no brainer!!! |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
This post started out asking if are class would get bigger events. Now in order to make this happen everyone is going to have to work together. It's doesn't matter who's rules are better or who's been pulling longer . So let's put our bull headed attitudes to rest and work together. And as for the guys up north and lowa just introduced the alcohol tractors 4 years go . David Runkle class rep for Badger State LLSS class. 815-821-4686 |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 01/04/2012 Posts: 156 |
there are 2 main reasons that BSTP is at a slower growth rate ,, and I STRONLY agree with both ,,,,, 410 cubic in and 3" charger ,,,,, that's were the diesels should be ,,,, in the relm of the 250 # weight handy cap ,,, my vote is give the diesel a slot or a choice of the slotted cover or the 250# advantage over a diesel ,,, why in holy hell would any organization on the planet ask a tech man to verify two different size turbos in the same class ,,,,,, and 104 cubic inches over a flippen spark plug moter ,,, come on southern diesel pullers ,,,,,, the entire Midwest is one 466 cubic inch class after another ,,, and they should be in our class B.S. …… Mr Larry Hawthorn just got 2nd at the Cowtown with a wimp as havin crankshaft , none crossflow head ,none head bolt sharing, 410 cubic inch engine !!!!!!!! congrats by the way to Larry and Mark !!!!! and ok this is to the point and gunna hurt some feeling butttt ,,,, truth is truth , Larry Phillips , Travis Gordon ,Alan Mohr ( A.C.) Larry Wright ,,,, you guys are takin advantage of week athourity and goin for the constant domination and I say B.S. A 466 in 3.4 , does not belong in the LLSS class ,,,,, |
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Re: LLSS
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interesting
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couldnt agree more the 3.4x4 turbo dont belong in the LLSS class |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
So what's the payout and purse for a class with 20-25 tractors in the south and how many do you pay down? With that question , I don't it's unreasonable to try for national hooks , because with them numbers the state hooks aren't going to miss a few tractors. |
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Re: LLSS
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Harry Hog
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Well it’s there and it’s staying the only people crying is you 410 guys get over it! All the alky guys like it an there’s no domination it’s fair play an you have a chance you guys cry over a turbo when your 250 more pounds that’s a huge huge advantage if it wasn’t you wouldn’t do it that way. If the NFMS added the class at 6000 or 6200 or even 6500 for everybody what would u do stay home? There’s a National set of rules for everybody an they are there in hope big events would add the class one day an they have something to go off of just because u 410 crybaby’s don’t like it don’t mean it’s needs changing stay in your lane with your 410s at 250 pounds heavier with what few alkies u pull against or go down south an show how bad that 410 is and that’s great Hawthorne got 2nd not 1st who got first an alky that has beat 470s and 410s so what’s your point? The diesel down south are winning some hooks with 90% alkys Brad an Travis Dueled it out all year long alky vs diesel an It was epic idk why you cry over something working so awesome. Really just making it look bad for the llss guys. |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
Wow , I thought I asked a simple question and you go hog wild? As for are weight difference , we took a stance on not spending money on Turbo's, second we didn't feel that are tech people shouldn't should be subjected to tons of turbo rules . Go back and read some comments on the WTPA and HSTPA , one gave on weight and the other on Turbo. I never said I didn't like the compromise , because this is where we're at . 3.4 and the slots and smooth bore Turbo's aren't going anywhere . But it's seems no one like compromise and everyone has there own opinions. Before the National Rules came out , seems to me everyone got along , and what was the turbo rules then ? |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 10/02/2009 Posts: 39 |
before national rules the turbo rule down here was a 3.6 for diesels. im pretty sure. would you be happier with that? |
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Re: LLSS
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Wi llss puller
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David Runkle, for being a class representative and a puller you never have anything good to say about this class on pull off. If you dont like how other clubs dont meet your rules then why don't you change your club rules to meet their rules if its such a big deal. And if you don't want to pull at bigger events thats fine but don't go wrecking it for the rest of us. |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
Call me , and with a real name , and with out hiding behind a computer . One thing being a class rep, I will stick up for our guys . Our rules never changed for 22 years in BSTP , then the alcohol were added and we have been bad mouthed for our options and just because we chose a weight difference over Turbo. I have never pushed a weight difference on anyone in this post , I said there need to be a compromise on weight at 6250 if you want everyone involved David Runkle class rep for Badger State LLSS class. 815-821-4686 Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/17/2020 06:07AM by David Runkle(earls dream). |
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Re: LLSS
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?
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Correct me if im wrong but isn't your weight 6250 or 6200 lbs or something like that, and if it is -- What are you giving up for the compromise ? Sounds like nothing really !!! |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 10/02/2009 Posts: 39 |
weight is no big issue for me really although I spent the time and money to build my tractor to have weight at 6000lbs so thats my preference as did many other tractors. I dont really see 6250 being a compromise as several places pull 6250 up north and south pulls 6000 so how is 6250 compromising? |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/24/2013 Posts: 155 |
I think Badger State is 6500lbs. |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
Guys this post started off as , will the LLSS class ever get big events. Ok now some clubs run 6000 # some 6250 and Some 6500 . Ok . The point wihich everyone miss is that I stated if big events ,so everyone can be evolved and have a chance to pull at Tomah or Farm Machinery show Mackville or Hillsbouro if they chose our class should be at 6250. Because everyone should be able to make that weight . And our basic rules our , diesel at 6500 and alcohol at 6250 with everyone using 3 by 4 smooth bore. This post was never started to be a rules argument. |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 10/02/2009 Posts: 39 |
I dont think its a rules argument. seems you want everyone to agree with your thinking on rules and nothing else. I think at big events 6200 would probably work for most but your turbo recommendation would not |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 02/19/2009 Posts: 526 |
To Travis. I would like you to go back and read every one of my post today . BECAUSE some ask what our weight was and my response was BSTP basic rules for our the class , I never pushed any Turbo rules . Did make mention of turbos used now in classes all ready running in every club that has a LLSS class . But hey at least we posted under our real names |
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Re: LLSS
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Harry hog
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You’re spending money/keep cost down Argument is invalid you’ve had the same turbo on since you built the tractor? spending money on turbos is The most common thing in pulling people will spend thousands of dollars for five extra horsepower with a new wheel or a new improved turbo In every single class. upgrade to better injectors or pumps or new set of 24.5s or 30s don’t keep the cost down either. wouldn’t it be easier to buy a bigger turbo that you don’t have to buy a new wheel every time new comes out just trying to keep up? If correct you just bought a new turbo? how long before a $7000 apex 3 inch turbo hits the llss class? a 3.4 is the best bang for buck power wise an cost wise in the end in my opinion. not changing wheels all the time or upgrading to the new best 3inch in the spring just to do it again in the fall. Not saying it does not happen with a 3.4 but it’s very less common with a turbo that isn’t used in 75% of pulling with 10 different company’s trying to sell the better 3inch all the time. |
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Re: LLSS
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LEWIS
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Harry dog you must me talking a box Turbo rule for your 3.4 chargers or how long befofe that 7000 dollar big bang for the buck charger oops classes get screwed up and die just because of not thinking things through if it can be done it will .Just as I SAID THE 3.6 WILL BITE THE CLASS IN THE ass the 3.4 will also and Anyone who is to stupid and does not realize who 250 pounds will help does not need to be involved in anything to do with long term rules .PS i like Travis and thank him for proofing my point by kicking ass with a 3.4 instead of a 3.6 BUT GUYS LIKE HIM COULD HAVE DONE IT WITH A 3X4 |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 09/24/2008 Posts: 176 |
So to David ; you are obviously respected by your piers to be in your spot so it doesn’t matter what others spout on here . Far as I see it the bitching only happens here by whiners ! The 3.4 turbo is an excuse for the “I can’t compete boo who excuse compared to the oh “yes I can” guys ie the hawthorns at 410 cid . Gotta have 100 extra cubes and a bigger charger to boot bs to lazy to do the work I guess . And let the alky have a 3.4 too lol oops cause more crying lol . I do disagree about LLSS being a stepping class to LSS most of us want no part of that expense lol. A select few with deep pockets made the jump that’s It. Not picking on anyone in particular but the weight is moot , so what if it’s 6250 , the southern boys that come up “north” all had front brackets full (6400lbs) up here and didn’t complain go figure that hype is all social media driven! This a great class a lot of fun with some really good people nation wide , show up and pull if they don’t like it don’t , but the class is still growing can’t all be bad go figure. The rules represent their respected areas as they should and as far as prime time events they should be made to reflect all of our rules as best they can ! Just an opinion of a puller who’s seen the pulling cycles for years . To all my fellow LLSS pullers have fun and a great year hope to see some of you soon ! |
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Re: LLSS
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Registered: 04/04/2008 Posts: 46 |
So...At the WTPA members meeting in December, it was decided that the WTPA LLSS class was (NOT) going to allow the 3.4 smooth bore turbocharger on there diesel tractors. They are only allowed a 3" slotted cover turbo. Regional LLSS is the 3.4 smooth bore, but only at regional events. All state hooks in WTPA are 3" slotted cover. The class members (Diesel and Alcohol) felt that the 3.4 would just make too much power at 6250 lbs.. That said....We all agreed that if there was a region hook we will participate. |
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Re: LLSS
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LEWIS
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You are a bunch of smart guys and nice to be willing to give alcohol tractors a chance in the future |
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Re: LLSS
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MAN
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You all suck and need to get a grip. Get over your idiotic 1 turbo, alky, weight bs. Your class is going no where because you can't agree on ANYTHING nor do you WANT to! |
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Re: LLSS
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Former 5500 super stocker
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I'm sure there are many people reading this forum and are thinking to theirselves whats so great about this class anyways? All they do is argue about rules and why do we want this class at bigger events when theres already a class like it "light super stocks" that have alot more power.
Well here are my thoughts: llss offers a side of pulling that many fans strive for which is not being a cookie cutter class. There are so many options and engine configurations a puller can use. Many different tractor brands and models get to pull in this class where they aren't able to pull in others. This class brings back the ability for an average person that knows how to turn a wrench to be able to get into the sport of pulling with a tractor that he/she can build themselves and not have to spend $100,000+ to have someone build it for them, with that being said, these tractors still makes a good amount of hp to put on a great show. Yeah they may not make as much hp as a LSS but theres many things that make up for it, like color varieties and engine configurations. Yeah theres some bickering going on with rules its hard to sugar coat that but at the end of the day if this class was booked at a large event the bickering would stop and llss pullers would make their tractors work for the rules. NTPA and PPL needs atleast one practical class like LLSS on their circuit. This is a class that a young adult has a chance to piece something together and be able to run at big events just like how some of us used to in the 80s. This is truly the answer on how to grow the sport of pulling. Thank you for taking time to read this as I wrote this from the bottom of my tractor pulling heart. |
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