Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls

Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 09, 2022 02:43AM

The Original Michael

Moderator
Registered: 07/06/2008
Posts: 1,347

If I asked "Who won the Pro Stock class at Louisville?," most people would say the name of the driver who won Finals. If I asked, "Who won the Pro Stock class at Hillsboro?," or substitute Chapel Hill, etc., someone may either ask "which hook?" or name both drivers (unless one puller swept both hooks).

For years, sanctioned pulling has been formatted with random sessions. For larger pulls, most classes get two hooks. The only two "Finals" I can think of seeing were Bowling Green's 50th Anniversary pull, and for a while, Tomah had 3 HSS and unlimited hooks and they would bring back the top 10 or 12 for Sunday night's session. That's it.

What if, for larger pulls (NTPA Super National and the PPL equivalent, say Hillsboro and Norwalk), the Super National/CT classes would get two prelim hooks, and then a Finals with a true event winner? That's one thing every single other form of motorsport has that pulling lacks. Even the local race track that runs 4 or 5 divisions of cars has a feature race for each division and a winner. NHRA National races may have between 8-17 different classes, depending on whether it's a smaller race like Epping, NH or the US Nationals at Indy. However, each one of these classes has eliminations and a true winner.

NFMS has had that since 1993, and it's elevated the prestige (and difficulty) of winning the event. In fact, the indoor pulls have this down quite nicely. Louisville, Gordywanna, Murfreesboro, Keystone Nationals all have Finals.

Yes, this may mean adding a session to some events. Yes, for a huge pull like Bowling Green or Tomah, the Finals may be on a Sunday (like the final session used to be), unless BG/Tomah maybe tweaked the schedule and started Thursday afternoon so the Finals could be Saturday night.

Pulling will always have the county fair, state fair, XYZ Speedway, and Podunk Molasses Festival types of pulls, but those aren't typically Champions Tour/Super Level stand-alone events. For the huge pulls, I feel like it would help promote the sport if there were two rounds of prelim hooks (think of them as qualifications) and a Championship Finals pull in the final session so our flagship pulls could have true class winners (and I understand Bowling Green's ring is a two-hook points combo, but the ring would fit just as well on the winner's hand if it was awarded by winning Finals.... just like at their 50th Anniversary pull a few years ago).

And, for those who believe a Finals would diminish attendance at the prelim hooks, you obviously have never attended Saturday qualifying at an NHRA event.

Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/09/2022 02:47AM by The Original Michael.

Reply Quote

Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 09, 2022 03:18AM

Brent Yaron

Registered: 12/19/2016
Posts: 1,162

This is exactly what the pull at Summit Motorsports Park in Norwalk, OH is doing this summer. Each of the 10 PPL Champions Tour classes will pull twice between Thursday night and Saturday afternoon. The top 5 (I believe) in combined finishes or distance (whichever route they decide to determine top 5) will come back for Saturday night.

Brent Yaron
Hooked Up Pulling Productions
hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com

Reply Quote

	Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 09, 2022 03:33AM
Suburban Farmboy Registered: 07/09/2008 Posts: 133	Hey, you quit knockin' on the Podunk Molasses Festival. They have the best peach cobbler in the world at that show! Reply Quote

Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 09, 2022 07:13AM

BrandonA

Registered: 08/16/2021
Posts: 306

I love the idea. I'm looking forward to seeing it at the World Series of pulling, and enjoyed seeing it at BG 50th.

My question would be, do the pullers like it? Would add another run down the track and another chance to break equipment. However, they are already there, most of them pull because they love to pull and are competitive, so I could see them being on board.

This would be a great time for someone like Todd Feiss to step in and give a perspective

Reply Quote

	Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 13, 2022 10:36AM
S'no Farmer Registered: 04/04/2008 Posts: 631	BrandonA, I've been to busy trying to get my tractors on the track and get my hay work done to look at this lately. My only initial thought is that if they are going to ask pullers to make more pases there needs to be compensation for the pullers. We have one fellow mod puller that never comes back for a pulloff and said he won't until they pay extra for that pass. S'no Farmer Reply Quote

Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 15, 2022 12:48AM

BrandonA

Registered: 08/16/2021
Posts: 306

Quote
S'no Farmer
BrandonA,
I've been to busy trying to get my tractors on the track and get my hay work done to look at this lately.

My only initial thought is that if they are going to ask pullers to make more pases there needs to be compensation for the pullers. We have one fellow mod puller that never comes back for a pulloff and said he won't until they pay extra for that pass.

S'no Farmer

It's hard to blame a guy for doing that. Just the price of fuel to go down the track an additional time is enough to put a hurting on guys not to mention the additional wear and tear on the machine. It stinks for competition purposes but totally understand your fellow pullers decision.

Reply Quote

Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 15, 2022 03:03AM

Fan 2

I am for NO regional classes at GN/SN events. Take the money they are paying for the regional classes and pay the GN guys to pulloff. There are regional, state, and brush pulls literally EVERY night in Ohio people can go to to see the regional stuff. Save the GN/SN pulls for the GN/SN equipment.

Watching the European pulls online the top guys always pulloff like it used to be over here. It is good for the show and the fans like it. Paying the pullers is doable if they cut out the lesser level classes from GN/SN events. I would rather watch 3 or 4 GN guys pulloff than watch a class of 10 or 12 regional tractors pull anyway. I can see that every night of the week here in Ohio.

Reply Quote

	Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 15, 2022 04:03AM
plb	The European pullers are having a hard time keeping their equipment together anymore as they are leaning on them harder and harder to keep up, Just like here. I bet you will see pull offs come to an end before long. They do run their shows as long as possible to sell lots of food and beer to pay for everything. Reply Quote

Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 16, 2022 02:03AM

Fan 2

My point was only about there being money to pay for the pulloffs. But since you mentioned how hard guys are "leaning" on their equipment now, I would challenge you to find me anyone leaning on their equipment as hard or harder than Tim Engler did? The idea that the guys now are running harder than the guys of the past is insulting to a whole generation of pullers! Engler was willing to destroy his stuff every weekend to win, and often did. Banters went through 17 blocks in one summer trying to win. There is no one now going through that many in 5 years. Dave Banter said "the only way to win with these (chevys), is to leave oil on the trailer floor. There were many other besides them over the years. In fact with the rules now in the Mod classes they aren't even allowed to run their stuff as hard comparatively as they did then. I understand the difference in power now, but the motors are not set on kill like they were back then. The Unlimited guys all have more power sitting there then they can use on all but 2 or 3 tracks a year. The stuff now is also built to better take the power than they had back then. They all pulled off! Many when they only had to bump the sled cause "it was good for the show"! That show in my view was more appealing than Regional stuff filling a couple classes, and one pass for the GN classes which often winds up with some running twice anyway due to a sled reset.

Reply Quote

	Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 16, 2022 02:09AM
cpr Moderator Registered: 03/19/2018 Posts: 664	You could not be more wrong. Between Shelton and Bauer, over 35 engines got wounded last year. CP Reply Quote

	Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 17, 2022 04:00AM
Fan 2	Maybe you should Read what I said. "17 blocks", not just "wounded engines". They all wound engines unfortunately. The 17 would be much higher by that standard. Reply Quote

	Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 17, 2022 04:44AM
Brent Yaron Registered: 12/19/2016 Posts: 1,162	Imagine how many more than 35 engines would be wounded if they were pushing Chevy engines like they do the Hemis. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com Reply Quote

	Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 21, 2022 12:05PM
plb	There are still pullers that WILL blow stuff up to win!! that will never change no matter what the rules are. Just saying pull offs these are fun to watch if they even have one, and if they do, some will not participate. Just the way it is anymore. Engler ran hard as he could to win and that tractor was its self a full time job! Ask Bibs!! Reply Quote

	Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 10, 2022 12:56PM
kevinh Registered: 12/23/2018 Posts: 257	Quote Suburban Farmboy Hey, you quit knockin' on the Podunk Molasses Festival. They have the best peach cobbler in the world at that show! Podunk pulls usually have some of the best food Reply Quote

Re: Modest proposal: Changing event format for largest outdoor pulls June 10, 2022 01:55AM

TripleAlphaProcess

Registered: 01/03/2019
Posts: 280

I think this is a good idea but if there are three hooks in a weekend then the "qualifying" hooks should be a "floating" finishing. I don't think many want to hook 5-6 times in a weekend. If the purse is increased significantly that might be a different story but otherwise the costs for the same purse could double.

The alternative is do what they do at BG or Hillsboro and have the ring winner or the buckle winner and therefore you already you already have two runs and a clear winner for the weekend.

Reply Quote