11:15:56am, Monday, October 14, 2024
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Gambling
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Disgraceful
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I find it very interesting that the 3 organizations can get in a room and agree that bringing gambling to the sport is one of the answers to the multitude of issues that plague this sport.
From a moral perspective it is a disaster. You can get on here and say you do not have to partake and it will still pollute the sport in a negative way. Time will prove this to be so because once you have open that door it is a slippery slope to the bottom. You can pick almost anything that was thought to be good and look at it now and it has destroyed what was good. Some examples 1. Welfare was thought to be good when it was first rolled out. Lets help people when they fall on hard time for a little while to help them back up. But what has happen generations of people have lived off of welfare and had no intentions of getting off and who pays for this? The rest of society. 2. The Lottery was suppose to help support schools and help keep your taxes down. How did that work The world is drowning in its own filth and pulling just wants to jump in and add to the cause. I was told be in the world not of the world. If the 3 organizations can get in a room and talk trash why can they not get in that same room and work as a unified body to make pulling better?? We all know and it has been stated on the board hundreds of times the various things that need to be done to help pulling across the board. But instead they choose to bring gambling to the pulling community as this is suppose to bring more folks in, WHAT A JOKE. An example to go along with this that happened a number of years ago. BG thought it would be great to sponsor a car for a NASCAR race to gain some notice and bring people in. How well did that work? The chase for the almighty dollar can do more harm than good and if I remember right IS IT NOT THE ROOT OF ALL EVIL?? |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 02/23/2012 Posts: 561 |
I agree |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 01/07/2022 Posts: 121 |
For the life of me I don’t understand how this helps the sport of truck and tractor pulling. This isn’t going to grow pulling. Pulling is a niche market. The only people that will be on it are people who are already fans. Some guy in Vegas might get bored and place a $25.00 bet on a sport he knows nothing about but that’s not putting a but in the seat. How is it leaders of the big 3 organizations can get in one room and agree on gambling but they can’t unify the rules? Far bigger problems facing truck and tractor pulling than betting. What are bets going to be placed on, half the time you don’t even know who is going to show up until show time. This isn’t going to bring in new sponsors. Pulling and the powers that be are throwing darts in a dark room hoping something hits the target. How are you going to keep competitors pure? Are they going to be banned from gambling on their class, the sport as a whole? Who is going to police it? For the sake of conversation and I’ll preface it by saying I don’t see this going anywhere, but; what happens when betting on pulling pays more than it does to win the event? Let’s say an advertiser comes along and wants to advertise with full pull bets, who gets that money? Let’s be honest there is going to be overhead and maintenance in keeping it running so I believe that is self explanatory and any good business will have a profit margin built in.
The biggest issue facing pulling right now is no one new is coming into it. We keep putting band aids on classes for tractors that were built in the 60’s. We keep creating new classes for those same tractors. Just look at the number of single charger variations out there. Look at the average age of pullers in any class be it light super, light pro, 4wd trucks. Most of those guys are over the age of 50 and quite a few over the age of 55. No one in their 20’s is getting into the sport on their own accord. No one under the age of 30 is building a pulling tractor. Fix that issue, unify the rules and you will have a viable motorsport for the future. Keep on the same trajectory and it will be done. Gambling to grow pulling, might be the single dumbest thing I’ve ever seen that people think this is going to grow pulling. |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 08/22/2019 Posts: 84 |
Soooo, I personally am not much of a gambler. And do have mixed feelings about it. I do however want to hear the idea out before I ridicule it. The little bit we know about it, isn't enough to make a claim that it is or isn't going to help anything. I understand why they announced it when they did. When else are you going to have that many pullers and the big 3 organizations at the same event. And if all 3 organizations are on board with it, they must see some value in it. Again, I am not saying this is the best idea ever, and I am not saying that this is going to kill pulling. Personally, it is all going to depend on how they do it. Honestly, if they would do it kind of like Fantasy Football, I think that would be fun. What they do successfully do is get a lot of people talking. |
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Re: Gambling
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!
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Seems like from all the post on this that's there's more against it than for it, could loose pullers, some will not want to be associated with this, ain't sayn they'll quit but may run at an organization that isn't apart of this, I think it should of been brought forth and got pullers opinions instead of just being implemented the way it was - this didn't grow Nascar any, look in the stands at Dayton, can pretty much pick your seat and set anywhere !!!!! I personally don't think it's a good move but that's just me !!! Pulling has got a great record and reputation of making bad moves and this is no different, history will back this up !!!! |
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Re: Gambling
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?
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One thing that hasn't really been discussed is, how many people will it drive away? It may turn people against pulling, alot of people is totally against gambling, so outcome could be pulling looses people, it's a two sided coin, may be more disastrous than anything !!!! |
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I do have a couple questions about the gambling issue.
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Moderator Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 1,540 |
Was not able to make it to the meeting, however I do have a couple questions. 1: and maybe the most important question is, how does this benefit the pullers monetarily. I'm not talking about more fan in the seats, I'm asking how does the puller make more money? And on the same vain how do the organizations make more money. 2, does gambling increase the paying fan base? 3, do I need an app to participate? 4, do I just send them my credit card info? 5, is it legal where I live? 6, how does the "house " make money? 7, do I need to buy a "membership"? 8, do I have to pay taxes on my winnings? 9, can a puller bet for or against their own vehicle? 10, who sets the odds for each class? 11, again, how does this grow the sport?
I sat with a friend last night who does have a betting app on his phone and he was not allowed to place a bet from his location. I know that people are talking about the Super Bowl and the number of bets placed, to use the SB, or any other large sporting events is very disingenuous. Pulling has a very small fan base. Dick Morgan www.PULLOFF.com Independent Pulling News Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2023 01:20AM by Dick Morgan. |
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Re: I do have a couple questions about the gambling issue.
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Registered: 01/07/2022 Posts: 121 |
If this is to grow pulling, how has gambling grown horse racing, rodeo, NHRA etc? What metric was used to say this is great for the sport? Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2023 02:15AM by OH1979er. |
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Re: I do have a couple questions about the gambling issue.
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Registered: 02/08/2014 Posts: 410 |
I have those same questions. |
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Re: I do have a couple questions about the gambling issue.
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Registered: 02/18/2023 Posts: 2 |
I’m willing to give this idea a try. Not sure how it will end up working with state laws for wagering, but I think it has some potential. Coming from a state that cannot bet on sports, but can bet on horse racing. I envision it to be closer to betting horses than sports. Is it what pulling needed to “revive” or bring new fans to the sport? Probably not. Will it be fun for those who are willing to play? Probably. |
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Who are the people running this and $$ paid to NTPA, PPL, Outlaws?
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Moderator Registered: 07/06/2008 Posts: 1,420 |
If one goes to the fullpullbets.com website, the contact link just has info@fullpullbets.com. There is no place on the website that actually lists the owners or officials of fullpullbets. So, I am asking here: Please list the names of all owners of this website/app.
Also, to get NTPA, PPL, and Outlaws to agree on anything has been like herding cats. In the interests of transparency, it would be interesting to know any financial arrangements between fullpullbets and board members, officials, or owners of the three pulling organizations (if such arrangements exist). I suppose it's possible the owners of this venture went to PPL, NTPA, and Outlaws and said "hey, we'd like to allow betting on your sport," and they all three said "great! No problem. Have at it!"...... However, I have a question for the pullers themselves regarding NTPA: When has NTPA ever done any service for the pullers that doesn't come with some type of cost, whether inspection fee or entry fee or competition license, etc? Is it likely NTPA (and the others), out of the goodness of their hearts, agreed to this with no funds exchanged? Possibly.... but based on history, is it just as likely someone with fullpullbets provided some financial incentive to NTPA, PPL, and Outlaws? Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2023 02:26AM by The Original Michael. |
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Re: Who are the people running this and $$ paid to NTPA, PPL, Outlaws?
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Posts: 1,206 |
Here's the LLC information. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: Who are the people running this and $$ paid to NTPA, PPL, Outlaws?
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Ryan s
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Richardson family I heard is running this joke |
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Re: Gambling
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Land of Confusion
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Hey I’ve got an idea! Is it a good one? Probably not
Let’s hype up a “major” announcement to be made at the biggest event of the year! Ok then what? Well the announcement will contain no valuable information, nothing pertaining to how it works, how and who it benefits or who is behind it. Only information we have is it could bring new people to the sport. How? Well because everyone wants to bet on sports duh! Ok how’s it work then…. Crickets. But it is intended to help the pullers! How? Better purses! How? Crickets again….. Sounds like this could get off to a bad start…. No we got that figured out! You do? Yeah we are gonna say to the doubters: you are stuck in the 70’s dude, or you got a better idea? Or don’t you want to see pulling grow? Oh I see! Basically what you are saying is you want to announce something huge, say it’s going to be great for the sport but have absolutely no information about how it works, who and how it benefits anyone, or any other pertinent information either on a Facebook page or it’s own website. Pure genius….. |
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Re: Gambling
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Posts: 1,206 |
Should have went to the meeting then. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: Gambling
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Land of Confusion
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Brent, what percentage of the sport of tractor pulling would you say was in Louisville and attended the meeting? Why is there a Facebook page and website with virtually zero information on them after the announcement of this new venture? Why did pullings 3 major organizations agree to be a part of this without approval of its members? This could have been a much better received idea if the presenters/owners along with the organizations could reasonably detail how they planned for this to better the sport itself instead of conjecture and wishful thinking. |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 01/07/2022 Posts: 121 |
Brent you’re a groupie, nothing more, nothing less. Passionate about the sport, I’ll give you some credit there. If this was a huge deal why wasn’t ESPN covering it, why at minimum wasn’t local news there getting it on tv? Why at one of the biggest pulls in the world did pullers have to pay for the opportunity to hear this earth shattering announcement? I’m sick and tired of people who have no skin in the game think they have the answers and want to defend stupidity like gambling. Go sit on rules meetings at the local, state and national level. Go get a real education on what the fights have been over the years and continue to be. |
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Re: Gambling
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Posts: 1,206 |
Answers like this are what make me question why I even try to help grow the sport. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 06/16/2017 Posts: 25 |
Then answer people's questions rather than say "should have went to the meeting then." |
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Re: Gambling
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Posts: 1,206 |
I don't have the information. I wasn't there. I'm going to wait until they come out with the information like everyone else should be doing. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 01/07/2022 Posts: 121 |
So if you didn’t have the answer and consider yourself a “face” of pulling or I think your generation likes the term “influencer” give a more professional response. Like, I wasn’t at the meeting but it will be interesting to see future announcements. Give a common sense defense of why you support it, how it is going to grow pulling, put more fans in the stands etc. show the metrics of how gambling has grown live attendance at other motorsports events. Again get involved outside of your weekly show and TPC. If you want to be respected give an answer people will respect even if they disagree and quit sounding like a know it all little kid who’s experience within the sport is minimal at best. |
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Re: Gambling
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Posts: 1,206 |
I already gave a lengthy response to it, see below. Also, if you think that's all I am involved with then you don't know me at all.
Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: Gambling
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About Time
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If anybody would happen to read this that new nothing about tractor pulling they would get the impression this sport is nothing but a bunch of closed minder old retired people up on there high horse looking down on the rest of us for being immoral sinners. I bet none of you drink alcohol or use tabacco products or ever been to a strip club either. I can not believe the amount of people flipping out about this and thinking they are above gambling. This shows exactly what is wrong with pulling and why most young people want nothing to do with it. |
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Re: Gambling
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Under_Pressure
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While I don't participate in or particularly care for gambling, my concerns aren't on the morality. If gambling makes you happy, go for it. I'm more concerned about people thinking this is a huge game changer for pulling, and that apparently the sanctioning orgs feel the same way. Because for all the legitimate issues there are for them to work on, there apparently was some level of collaboration between the big 3 to give this an official endorsement? That's ridiculous. If someone wanted to make an app to bet on pulling, fine, but to have the organizations formally support it is crazy.
It is truly frightening the number of people who think "this is exactly what pulling needs" and apparently feel that one of the big reasons pulling isn't as big as football is because pulling doesn't have formalized betting. Lastly, of ALL the motorsports to bet on, pulling seems like one that makes the least sense. In large part because unlike any other motorsport, there is a another mechanical element involved (the sled) which is far more important in determining the outcome than any aspect of the pulling vehicles themselves. It opens up all kinds of questions about whether, intentionally or not, the sled operated exactly the same hook to hook, the measurements for tight classes, etc. If people start having serious (to them) amounts of money riding on the outcome, it could cause all kinds of headaches real quick. |
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Re: Gambling
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surprise !!!
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The NFL has self gambling, just another way for big money to make more, The Lord Said that greed and gluttony would be man's down fall. |
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Re: Gambling
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About Time
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How do you not hear how stupid you sound. Greed and Gluttony will be our down fall if we allow gambling. If you want to go that far the intire sport of tractor pulling is nothing more then Greed and Gluttony and people showing of how much money they can blow on a hobby. Give me a fing break. This sport is obviously nothing but a bunch of hypocrites that can't stand the idea of someone new playing in their sand box and making money off of it. Thats really all this comes down to. Everyone is afraid somebodys going to make a dime and it wont be them. If this goes over and a year from now the payouts get doubled in all classes you will all be taking the money so shut up. |
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Re: Gambling
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Land of Confusion
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If you’d like to discuss intelligence levels I’ll be happy to oblige you. Test level 1: Major changes or additions should be introduced with all pertinent information related to its operation, it’s goals and how it plans to achieve them. True or false? The business plan presented so far is asinine at best. Test level 2: If purse’s double it still won’t be enough, care to guess why? If purse’s double will participation in the sport increase or decrease and why? |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 10/10/2022 Posts: 46 |
“Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”
― Mark Twain |
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Re: Gambling
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abouttime2
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Oh My Oh My oH, so many are narrow minded, - with blinders on, over all Big Money runs all things, always Has, Always will.DUH !!!!!!! |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 10/30/2018 Posts: 749 |
Anyone on here could win a lot Heck pick Chizik 6 out of 10 times no way to loose and just go through each class whith the big money known faforites just like a horse they may stumbel or break a leg sumtimes but easy pickens |
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Re: Gambling
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Face in crowd
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Um, no. Pick a Chizik tractor and bet $100 to win $150 probably, or in other words risk $100 in order to win $50. And that's if that Chizik tractor also had to compete with the other two that he has. When you say "easy pickens" that tells me that you've never bet on the ponies before. |
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Re: Gambling
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Jay Leno
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After reading all these comments and the comments on various Facebook pages I am convinced this is all been a joke like the old jay walking segment on the tonight show. I mean there are people on Facebook honestly asking if children or anyone under the age of 21 would be allowed at the county fair pull if gambling is taking place at it. Seriously are we as a pulling community this stupid or is this all a big joke. Has to be a joke dosent it. We can't be this stupid we just can't. |
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Re: Gambling
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huh?
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At the 'big meeting', who presented this absolutely amazing and revolutionary pulling betting scheme? |
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Re: Gambling
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Moderator Registered: 03/25/2008 Posts: 1,540 |
I asked 11 questions = crickets Dick Morgan www.PULLOFF.com Independent Pulling News |
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Re: Gambling
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I commend the three sanctions for actually agreeing on something. Maybe some uniform rules next?? But let’s say this takes off and goes big time. Bob makes a million dollar bet on tractor X to win chapel hill. You’re the sled operator for the pull. Three days before the pull Bob shows up at your door and tells you that he’ll give you $100,000 to make sure that tractor X wins. You gonna tell Bob to pound sand or put $100k in your pocket? |
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Re: Gambling
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being that Bauer is the sled and operator you are hypothetically saying would take a bribe I'm certain it would take more than a 100k to influence him and Sacrifice his reputation and his company's reputation just to help someone else make a fraction of the money he already HAS. |
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Re: Gambling
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And really there are several more ways to influence the out come of a tractor pull than just a sled operator. From manipulating pulling position, bribing track maintenance crew, there are underhanded ways we haven't even thought of yet possible. |
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Re: Gambling
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Really
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All of you that come on here and say this is gonna encourage cheating, and all of that must be the type of people who would actually do that. I would like to believe that the top three organizations have people in place who are people of integrity and people who will do their job, if they weren’t that type of people, they wouldn’t be working for the top three organizations, I also believe that 99% of the pullers have integrity also, those who will cheat are cheating now, and those with integrity will never cheat, no matter what the dollar amount is ,they love the sport, and they would never sacrifice their reputation for dollars otherwise they wouldn’t be in a sport that cost so much money, so give up on that argument like I said and I’ll say it again those who will cheat will cheat for no money and yes they will still cheat for more money but those are the people that are doing it anyway ,the other 99% are cheating now and won’t do it no matter what dollars are offered to them because their reputation means more than money. |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 04/04/2008 Posts: 646 |
Really,
I had a post on the other thread about a similar thing. It would more likley be a fan that would try it influence the outcome of a class than a puller. Someone places a large bet on a lesser tractor in the class then walks the pits waits for an opening when no one is around loosens a fuel line and walks away 30 seconds later. Do I think this will happen, no could this happen, yes. We as pullers have never really had to worry about leaving our pullers unattended in the pits, let's hope that doesn't change. On a side note just to show how easy this can be, a fellow puller was at the Enderle many years ago when he went down the track one engine didn't come up on RPMs...someone had walked by and unclipped the throttle linkage at the injector hat. That takes about two seconds...the engine started and idled fine but didn't come up on RPM when he left the line. When you have four loud engines it's almost impossible to realize that one isn't right until it's too late. Am I against the gambling idea, no I could care less either way but this was the first weird thought that crossed my mind. It will be interesting to see how it goes, hopefully smooth sailing. S'no Farmer |
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Re: Gambling
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F-30puller
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I've had someone loosen the distributor and change timing in the pits.... on a damned antique.... So not unfounded. |
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Re: Gambling
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OGPP
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Had someone loosen my fuel pump belt once at a two day pull, happened overnight, ran good 1st night, wouldn't rev up second night, dropped 6 places and found it an fixed it in time . |
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Re: Gambling
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Spectator
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Wow tractor pullers sound like some of the most honest upstanding citizens in the country. Luckily you found it and fixed it in time. Why the hell would people do these things. |
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Re: Gambling
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PDT
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And those that do unintentionally? Take the Mitas tires issue this winter for example. |
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Re: Gambling
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Tom Ethington
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Speaking of betting, I can bet you one thing, if Doug Roberts was still in charge of Outlaws, they wouldn’t be part of it. |
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Re: Gambling
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Mouthy
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That's the great thing about betting, you have the opportunity to put your money where your mouth is. |
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Re: Gambling
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Outlaw fan
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Winner Winner Chicken Dinner! This is about the stupidest @#$%& I’ve ever heard anyone get sucked into! Wonder how how much loud mouth @#$%& Brain is making off this Scheme? |
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Re: Gambling
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Been around
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Just like at a casino, it will be guaranteed that the people running the gambling are the ones making the most money.
I definitely agree that this could bring a demise to the integrity of the sport. Does anyone else remember when the secondary chain fell off of Vaughn Bauers sled 3 times at Bowling Green in 1995? It wouldnt have been a big deal, but all 3 times it happened to the same tractor and an Iowa tractor won the ring because of it. As for sabotage, pullers could all be victim to that from anyone with a financial interest. Wait until they start taking bets on whose engine might explode or who might rollover. Don't think it can't be done. We already don't have the resources to make things as safe as they could be. Why create more problems? |
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Re: Gambling
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Dutch
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I think this could also be a safety issues for teams and crew. Just look at professional sports for example. If a player makes a huge mistake or takes a costly penalty....look on the internet after the game. The player is getting death threats.
I fear if someone has a large wager on a puller/outcome and somebody else wins.....would they get confronted in the pit area?? Alcohol and money make people do stupid things. |
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Re: Gambling
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I Agree
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I also fear for the safety of my fellow pullers. Not just from this but everything. I think we should all wear helmets in the pits and stands just incase. I hope everyone is still wearing 2 masks because you know... covid. Maybe we could wrap the haulers in bubble wrap when parked in the pits incase someone would stumble into one. There is lots of things we could be doing for safety.
Be safe out there. |
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Re: Gambling
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Doug Borth
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Tune in tonight Monday Feb 20 at 8pm central on Let's Grow Pulling for more details |
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Re: Gambling
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News Flash
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In the world that doesn't believe anything and everything is opened up to some conspiracy theories this will be the same. |
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Re: Gambling
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PDT
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Anything for clicks, likes, and "engagement," am I right? |
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Re: Gambling
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Or maybe just for information |
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Re: Gambling
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PDT
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If it was just for information, they'd simply post it. You wouldn't have to "engage" and listen to an hour of drivel just to find out the information everybody wants to know. Chances are, the real information people are asking for, won't even be offered up. |
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Re: Gambling
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Moderator Registered: 02/21/2012 Posts: 803 |
PDT, you didn’t happen to go to school for marketing, did you? John Murray Two-time Pedal Pull World Champion Let's Go Pulling, covering the sport of pulling in Kentucky, Tennessee, and Alabama. Watch LGP on YouTube Like LGP on Facebook 
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Re: Gambling
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PDT
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Nope. But I can tell you when the answer to a question asked is "you'll have to tune in to find out," the last thing I'm going to do is tune in. Probably even go as far as paying even less attention in the future. |
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Re: Gambling
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Posts: 1,206 |
If you have questions call Chase Richardson. He will be glad to answer any questions you may have, but he might not be able to answer them all just yet. They can't say a whole lot until everything gets through the gaming commissions. The lawyers are the ones who are restricting how much information can be shared at the current time. Brent Yaron Hooked Up Pulling Productions hookeduppullingproductions@gmail.com |
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Re: Gambling
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Bob Barbee
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Read the above statements and the ones about the announcers and the music at the Farm Show and let it sink in why Pulling is such a small niche sport. I was there, it was fun free food and drinks, a good amount of information. Yes you'll have to download an AP, yes its legal in all areas is my understanding with the Law changes, yes you'll have to pay taxes same as any winnings. The info was for every dollar spent betting, a portion will go to the Associations working with The Group, and that money a portion will go to enhance the winnings going to the Pullers. Nothing specific yet, but it was just an initial Launch, info will follow. I'm not a Gambler so to speak, a group of my friends draw numbers on every session at farm show every year and we do $5 each to the pot, its a bunch of fun and Bobbie and I made $110 this year. Is this going to send me directly to Hell? So here goes all the questions bout how much money the group will make, then how much the Associations will make...blah blah blah. YES these folks are in this to make money and I hope they Kill it! I also hope it brings a bunch of new folks to Pulling, because it never ceases to amaze me all over the Country people at events that tell me they had no idea about Pulling. I'm really tired of key board folks who do zero for the sport taking anonymous jabs at People who actually are sticking their neck out and hoping to build something for the sport, also very enthused that someone from the Pulling World seems to be in a very high position in this deal, He will care about the sport and the competitors, who knows maybe that's what drove Him to step up.
BB |
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Re: Gambling
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Moderator Registered: 02/21/2012 Posts: 803 |
You cannot bet on March Madness or the Super Bowl in Kentucky. You cannot place a bet (without the exception of horse racing) without crossing the river. Sports betting is not currently legal in the state of Kentucky, which made the announcement at the Farm Show a little ironic. John Murray Two-time Pedal Pull World Champion Let's Go Pulling, covering the sport of pulling in Kentucky, Tennessee, and Alabama. Watch LGP on YouTube Like LGP on Facebook
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Re: Gambling
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Observer
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I'm mixed on how I feel about this coming to the sport. Yes this would be awesome if this brings more money and fans to the sport. But what are the downfalls or what is. Money makes people do funny things. Cash is king. What happens if someone goes to the pits when no one is around the top running vechile that has been known to win a lot and cuts the fuel line? Do you then have to shut the pits off from spectators? Chances of that happening are probably slim. But all sides do have to be looked at. |
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Re: Gambling
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It’s a process
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All that has been said by the Full Pull Bets brand is that they are WORKING to bring legal wagering to the sport of pulling. There has been no announcement about how the wagering will work, and that is ok. They are months away from that aspect of it from what I’ve heard. The purpose of making the announcement to competitors and individuals (at a private event, not public) within the sport last week was to spread awareness that it was indeed coming to the sport, and they wanted those individuals to know before hand, not “after the fact” when they are doing real advertising and marketing of the product. Kudos to them for presenting it the way they have to this point, showing respect to the people that makeup the sport. |
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Re: Gambling
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Change of heart
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I had been against this gambling on pulling idea, maybe it was the way the announcement was done with the lack of information (I know why they can't give out all the info now). Maybe it was the way how any "naysayers" comments/concerns were responded to by others, maybe it was aggressively being told "this is happening and you can't stop it" surely didn't help matters. Lots of reasons, but with no where to direct valid concerns without being ridiculed might be the worst part because it didn't provide answers to concerns.
Given all of that, if you are simply against gambling/betting my comment is not for you and I can't nor do I want to change your opinion because you're entitled to it. If you're against it because you have valid concerns or just not enough information then this is for you. I know it has been said Chase will talk to any puller that wants to discuss this, but he doesn't make the rules for the pulling association. I reached out to my pulling association to a person that I trust to listen but be open and honest with me and not sugarcoat things. I expressed my concerns and asked how is "this" association going to deal with these concerns, handle this kind of situation, how can such and such be prevented. (Insert your own concerns). We had a lengthy conversation in which my concerns were heard and discussed. At the end of the conversation, I was asked how do you feel about this now? My answer- better, not 1,000% but more like 97% and more on board with betting than before that phone call. The association acknowledged and validated those concerns while providing answers, solutions, reassurance or at times all three. Here's the important things: You need to discuss this with your association they are the ones making the rules for your pulling organization. Be respectful in offering your point of view and be respectful in listening to the opposite. Make sure your concerns are heard and taken seriously but be open to the answers and solutions they have in place. Your concerns might require them to put something into place if its not already or make everyone aware of what is in the rule books already. Belittling or attempting to humiliate someone because they have a different point of view or that they just have concerns, is not helping the cause and is certainly not how the pulling family should treat one another. |
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Re: Gambling
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Donk
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Food for thought.
If you look at sports in general you find that they ban betting on not only their sport but all competitions for the participants, owners, officials, and pretty far reaching for others affiliated with their sport. Are there some pretty severe consequences for getting caught ignoring? Answer is yes. Why? As the NFL put it "to protect the integrity of the game and the sporting world". Why would the "pulling community" and/or a pulling organization choose not to address this? Is this something that the gaming commissions address or mandate? |
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Re: Gambling
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bonk
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Reading this Gambling thread, it appears like there are a lot of carts ahead of the horse.
Here's some basic questions. What is Chase Richardson's resume? What is his profession? His skills and accomplishments thus far for a young guy? Why is he the one to head up this pulling gambling scheme? Is he the owner of it? A means for him to become wealthy? What is his knowledge and experience and expertise and success in gambling? Why should he be trusted? Question for "bandit 496" since it appears like he is the only WPI/NTPA board member to frequent this chat board. Were those 2 pulling boards of directors presented with this gambling proposal? If so, did each board vote upon accepting or rejecting it? If you guys did vote, was it an overwhelming majority in favor? For those opposed, what are those views of concern? |
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Where Ohio Stands
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Registered: 01/07/2022 Posts: 121 |
The Ohio Casino Control Commission hasn’t received and application from full pull bets or full pull entertainment as of yet. When they broadened their search to see if it fell under the umbrella of a larger company such as draft kings nothing was found in their query. When they searched out farther nothing for truck or tractor pulling has been submitted to the Ohio CCC. Aside from a company having an application submitted for sports wagering the sanctioning bodies of said sport have to be on record with the Ohio CCC as to what rules govern their sport and its competitors for gambling. In Ohio the NTPA, PPL, and Outlaws are not listed under professional organizations, NBA, MLB, NFL etc are but nothing in the realm of professional truck and tractor pulling. This thing still has miles to go before it’s up and running. I would urge competitors regardless of which side of the aisle you fall on to contact your respective sanctioning bodies. I would urge sanctioning bodies to put it to an individual vote of paid competing members. Sanctioning bodies are going to have to write rules governing their competitors and wagering, at least in Ohio. Once all of that is done the Ohio CCC will give a thumbs up or down. |
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Re: Gambling
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pulling fan
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Ha ha ha. This is nothing more than a fast scam to trick some unlucky farmer into lightening up his pockets. Think about this.... Vegas controls gambling. They will not let a small guy play in their play ground and take their money. The reason anyone would try such a small market is to sneak it past Vegas. |
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Can pullers opt out?
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curious
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If a puller does not want people betting on their vehicle, will they be given the option to opt out, meaning their name/vehicle will be removed from the betting slate? |
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Re: Can pullers opt out?
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LSS Fan
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Haha no, you can’t “opt out” |
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Re: Can pullers opt out?
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Yes
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Only way you could opt out would be to stay home. No offense but questions like this make me question just how many tractor pullers live under rocks and have absolutely no idea how things work out in the world. |
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Re: Can pullers opt out?
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DOA
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Stop worrying about it. It's never going to happen. |
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Re: Can pullers opt out?
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Rich
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The rich benefit, the common folk pay,and laws to regulate, not so much, casinos pay huge fines, - but why, cause they don't pay out the lawful amount, -SO BIG DEAL, PAY MILLIONS IN FINES FOR THE VILOLATION, DUH, THE PROFITS FROM FRAUD ARE TEN TIMES THE FINES. Someone above stated greed and gluttony,- others laughed, - what do you think drives politicians and takers,-it most likely was never intended to refer to pulling and gambling only,the sheep get courted into the gas chamber, history does repeat itself. |
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Re: Gambling
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Insider Trading
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Lots of good points brought up on how many variables there are and can be within this sport and I would like to add yet another tangent to it: As a puller within almost any organization/group/club you/I typically pull against the same vehicles every week, just different places and of course there are always some wild cards that show up in said class, but "as a puller" you typically have a good idea how this wildcard vehicle runs as it's probably not the first time you've seen it or you know other pullers, how their vehicle runs/competes with your own and they have competed against it somewhere.
Legitimacy and honor were brought up: It takes machine shops long enough to get things done and since the Covid supply disruption, parts take longer yet. So lets say my class of 10 has 15 hooks this season and I'm waiting on parts for my good engine, but aside from any betting going on, I just wanna run and run my spare engine which runs "ok", this results in me ending up in the back of the pack all season, I get my good motor back in for hook 15, I am 95% sure who is coming to that hook in my class and I know my good motor can beat 7 of them for sure as I know they haven't changed anything from last season. What I also know is that my 2 main competitors have some issues, "Bob" will not be there as his father was admitted to the hospital last night (because him and I talk because we are good friends) and "John" dropped a valve last pull which was 2 days prior and I know he can't get it fixed in time, so he is gonna be MIA or running on his spare motor. So beings this is all somewhat normal information and knowledge to me, I am thinking it's a wise choice to bet $2000 on myself as my vehicle is now at 40:1 odds to win and I can get this good motor paid for and then some. Is that wrong? Will we as pullers be under some sort of obligation to report every change we've made for better or worse "odds"? Are we in trouble if we don't because we don't care and just want to pull? Maybe I changed my tires, may do the trick, may raise holy hell with my setup, that's a personal gamble there, I don't know what's going to happen, that will be up to someone to speculate. Then there is the time crunch issue, if "John" does get his spare motor in and shows up at the pull, is "Vegas" going to know this somehow? John was 1st place 10/14 pulls this season, now he may be 8th tonight with his spare motor or maybe John had another "should be a runner" motor getting worked on (unknown to me) and he got that stuck in there and I'm gonna be out $2k. Is "Vegas" going to have to hire someone to fish for all this info within every class? I'm not a big NFL/NBA fan or anything, but hear enough on the radio or TV of when said star player got hurt at practice or something of that nature. I have done nothing illegal here, these motor/parts/tractor/truck issues/gremlins plague pullers all the time and no one ever cared except the puller and his/her fan base and of course his or her competition as that "chump change" for moving a place up is all there's, lol! We all know the ROI on this sport/expensive hobby is terrible, but now here is a chance to re-coupe some of the money "legally". If pullers are not allowed to bet on themselves and I want to buy my neighbors combine and I tell him (what is general class knowledge to me) what is going on with the class and he places a bet, wins and is so grateful for my information he knocks 80k off the combine price, perhaps for the reason of he agreed to sell me the combine at said price, but since he has won it big gambling, he doesn't want that much income this year, so he cuts me a deal. Who is to prove anything? He just bet on his neighbor as that's the neighborly thing to do right? Take our/my personal aspirations of betting out and lets say there is fan/gambler who gives me $100 to pick my brain on my class every week/weekend with no strings or implications attached, I've just become a "mole" if you will, for all I know he calls the other 9 people in the class to and has an algorithm on a spreadsheet setup to sort the info into his own odds. I am sure the people "Vegas" hires to get information get a salary or a commission of sorts, why not me/you? Then as the pullers we typically are, we sometimes stretch the truth, embellish, downplay, leave something out, buy plastic suitcase weights or completely make something up when we are talking to other pullers (can't be giving away secrets). Will we now be fined or kicked out for that when "The House/Vegas" loses a bunch of money on bad info? |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 08/16/2021 Posts: 337 |
This is actually a phenomenal thought process on gambling in pulling Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/01/2023 12:33PM by BrandonA. |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 03/31/2008 Posts: 781 |
I’m not much of a gambler, but I am intrigued how this will play out. I have to think the betting will only be on select members of each class. For example, possibly only the pre committed NTPA pullers. They may need PPL and Outlaw to start similar pre-entry commitment programs. I don’t see how they would be able to set odds on 50+ Twd’s at BG and manage their risk, or the classes of the many state and regional groups. |
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Re: Gambling
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My opinion- is it not going to be betting on distance? That was what was on the two wheeler drive truck at the farm show it had on the body - where distance wins- |
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Re: Gambling
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Options
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My opinion, the options are limitless. Bet on the winner, the placing, the distance, the color of the winning tractor or make of the winning pickup, how many break in a class, the shortest distance pulled in a class, if the sled gets reset, how long the pull lasts. Hell you can bet on the coin flip of a football game. Anything is possible.
There are those out there that will gamble and place bets on anything. I have seen people with such an addiction to gambling they can't watch a high school football game without placing a bet. And if you don't relize there is a local bookie taking that bet in you're town you just ain't looking in the right place. Maybe i am naive that more are not aware of how available this is. Making it leagle and trying to get some money back to the pulling organizations and pullers is a good thing. The only real difference for this is some of you are being made aware of its existence. |
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Re: Gambling
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Registered: 06/25/2008 Posts: 66 |
There apparently is no limit to what people will try to gamble on: [www.cnbc.com]
If you don't want to click the link, the WWE is trying to legalize gambling on their scripted pro wrestling matches. I'm betting our society doesn't survive but another decade or so. |
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Re: Gambling
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Greed and addiction
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I bet you are right!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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