New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 27, 2017 11:45AM
This weekend we began a new season of NASCAR racing where new rules and a very odd stage system left many fans already disappointed in NASCAR With attendance way down from the best days from the mid-nineties to the mid-2000's NASCAR has tried to recapture that magic with little luck. Continue Reading...


Dick Morgan

www.PULLOFF.com
Independent Pulling News



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2017 01:13PM by Jake Morgan.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 27, 2017 12:04PM
I would like to see the diesel and alcohol pull against each other again



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2017 01:14PM by Jake Morgan.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 27, 2017 12:18PM
Dick if you honestly take a real hard look at why #'s are declining in certain 3classes I think you'll find that component chassis and any sheet metal any engine is not the underlying cause. It's all about the money and technology available today that wassn't available 20-30 years ago. That money and technology is what necessitated some of necessary rule changes which have had to be made to harness the power it has allowed. Even your cast based tractors are producing very consistent runs and many of your 466 based tractor classes are making as much or more power than some of the top contenders of the late 80's and early 90's. Maybe you should consider blaming the dyno guys or the turbo guy or the engine builder who pushed the envelope to break the barriers no one ever thought could possibly be broken?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2017 01:14PM by Jake Morgan.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 27, 2017 03:14PM
Exactly we replaced the 2000 to 2500hp SS of the 90s with new classes of 2000 hp tractors. It cost less money to make 2000 hp.

Now the DSS are north of 4000hp.

It's all money. More choose to join the other class options.

Then add the sled advancements. Pulling has changed a lot just because of the sleds.

The 90s are gone. They aren't coming back.

I agree Nascar is long gone for me, but pulling still has a great following and many tractors filling the cast chassis 1500 to 2000 hp classes. The promoters that book the right classes and mix for their areas are growing their pulls year to year.

It's thankless and hard work but it's being done.

Fans can also still go to big pulls and see the best of the best in the big hp classes.

We only have an issue with classes if you still think every county fair is going to have 20 dss, 20 twd, 15 mods, and 15 4wds. It's just not the case.

Today the dss are the limited pros and sf type classes. That's what the market is bearing for supply. And cost is dictating it.


COO for OTTPA

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2017 03:17PM by AV.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 27, 2017 12:33PM
Dick your 100 percent right in all aspects but if I said it someone would have done told me to shut up . No offence to the SS classes but they totally suck if compared to the 80s or 90s as I said before you could go to the county fairs and se good pulls with good numbers in the classes all classes needs good rules that needs to be stuck with I wish Doug could bring his Outlaws to KY just to get to se some real SS tractors pull again .Don't get me wrong I love the big modifieds with 4 or 5 v8s and skidder rear ends but not the skidders with hoods on them and yes I know theyre here to stay but they will end up pulling at only a select few places because they are pricing themselves out now someone can tell me how stupid I am but watch and se



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2017 01:14PM by Jake Morgan.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 27, 2017 12:55PM
I agree with Dick. Also not all but most of these tractors along with other classes are turn key tractors. If you have the money you just go and buy one and drive it. Not like when it was personal mechanical savvy. I guess that's why I like the local classes better.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2017 01:14PM by Jake Morgan.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 27, 2017 03:39PM
I agree with most of the OP's comments except for combining the supers. There are LLSS classes all over the place that keep changing their rules to try and appease everyone. It's just too much of a difference in power in my opinion. Plus with the technological advances that happen almost yearly, you'll have to change the rules every year. And you'll be guessing every year. As far as the pulls go, I like how the Europeans tow the puller past the crowd after they run. Good way to thank the pullers.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 01:29AM
I agree with AAR actually and AV when I first started pulling back in the early nineties it was backyard mechanics trying new set ups ( trial and error ) and run what ya brung type fun pulling on pretty low budgets for the most part. Now since dyno's have come onto the scene which don't get me wrong is great for advancing hp but it has created a vicious circle of spending money, because now we have guy's who dyno regularly which in turn has builders constantly building bigger badder injectors, pumps, turbo's, cylinder heads, manifolds etc. which then makes the turbo or pump you just bought less than a year ago ( which wasn't cheap ) outdated and useless within a season so you have to buy new ones to keep up or get left behind. The actually cost of everything has just become unobtainable for your average guy who wants to go pulling and have some fun. It's great to see the technology and power of today but I miss the simpler days and it will be interesting to see what direction the sport goes in the future I just hope the numbers in the bigger classes don't keep dropping off.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 02:25AM
I know a certain altered farm class, where it takes 1200hp to win $200. This year it will probably take over 1300.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 05:32AM
Money has crippled the sport pulling more than anything else. The classes that have no limit on turbo size are the classes that numbers are stagnant or dwindling. Unlimited turbo(s) requires an unlimited budget, if your not winning then you can just write a bigger check and buy a bigger and better parts, which means more horsepower. With more horsepower, it starts breaking parts that have never broken before. And that is why we have component chassis now. Component and “any sheet medal, any engine” rule has not hurt pulling it has brought color back to the sport of pulling. With out these two rules, pulling would be more like Nascar in the fact that there is only two or three brands competing. The fastest growing classes, are the classes with a turbocharger limit. By limiting the turbocharger size, it evens up the playing field and makes budget less of a factor. Even though I am against them, A "spec turbo" is the most effective way to even up the playing field and make a class even less about money.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 06:12AM
I totally disagree that any sheet metal any engine has helped the sport. Nobody cares if a BBJD with MM sheet metal or Massey sheet metal is pulling, it has not drawn any new fans to the sport. Yet when Carlton Cope or Travis Kuhns hooks with their Massey's fan are excited, they know what they are seeing is the real deal. I think people sell the fans way to short that believe they think that's a MM or any other color pulling, they all know it's a BBJD or a red motor under the of this cross dresser..


Dick Morgan

www.PULLOFF.com
Independent Pulling News
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 08:02AM
How do you know it hasn't drawn any new fans???
You can not prove that statement.

There are some minnie mo guys that although know it's not a true MM, still are drawn to it because of the different look they like.


I know for a fact, I paid more attention to the MM when it pulled and actually was a pretty well discussed every year at Tomah in our section, and we actually go walk around it every year and bring people that are along to look. They have sold T shirt to people in our group that only go to Tomah each yr.

And at NFMS we sat in a section with red fans that were all talking about cotton pickin deere and rooting for that tractor to win. Fans that normally wouldn't care but it was something new to talk about and jab the green guys about.

Cope and Kuhn have great following and very deserving. That doesn't mean that is absolute on how all fans are and want.

.


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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 09:16AM
AV thanks for your response. Well I don not have any numbers that prove my opinion [which is really just my opinion] I have yet to meet any fans that are all excited about a BBJD MM. Maybe it's just me that thinks it's just one more step in the delegitimizing of the sport. The sheet metal is not what the fans are cheering for, especially after the announcers tell everyone that there's really a John Deere engine under the hood.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/28/2017 09:17AM by Dick Morgan.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 09:53AM
Well look at it this way, if the MM had deere sheet metal on it, would it be noticed at all or anymore than the other deeres?

It's just another deere in the mostly deere PS class. Not that that's bad, its just the way it is.

Now they took a deere and made it stand out to the fans. Is it a true blood MM? No, but it's something NEW for fans to see, talk about. Let's be honest their isn't going to be any true and new MM joining the PS ranks anytime soon, maybe ever.


To me this scenario is probably a net positive to the PS class. Deere fans have tons to choose from, now this one deere sticks out to the fans.


I am not saying I wish everyone would do the same or that the rule has been a windfall for pulling. But I do think on the small sample that has exercised the rule has given the fans something new, and hasn't hurt pulling in any way.


COO for OTTPA

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www.truck-specialties.com

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/28/2017 09:57AM by AV.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 11:24AM
Dick, the flip side to your argument would be the example of the Minneapolis Moline as you will not see a true moline engine in any of the diesel classes. So the question is would you rather see another Deere or a Moline with a viable power plant? If it had an 8.3 Cummins in it would there be the same uproar? It's no different.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 12:33PM
AAR, thanks for your response. I am not in favor of any engine that does not have any OEM part number associated, and yes that includes the Hyper block. The real problem that has caused the associations to go down the any any road is terrible rules. The 600 plus cubic inch classes do not allow any other brands to compete on a level playing field. I am sure that when the power_to_be saw the 680 PS class they could never fathom that the HP numbers and associated cost would be where they are today. My real concern is that the LLSS and other smaller cubic inch classes will blur the lines and every tractor in the class will be Cummins powered, bending rules can be a class killer.


Dick Morgan

www.PULLOFF.com
Independent Pulling News



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/28/2017 12:39PM by Dick Morgan.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 02:13PM
We as a LLSS class in Badger State decided that Cummins should be only used in the AGCO family tree, AC , Massey ,Oliver so we could have more color. JD and IH have many options in engine combinations for this class , and yes the Caseih Maxxums used Cummins which is legal . So to keep the cummins in check will be up to the people that make the rules and inforce them.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 06:36AM
Look what Outlaws has done when Roberts started going to box turbos just about 10 years ago now. He caught a lot of slack on here and from some of his members, but stuck with it and look how it has turned out. They are gaining events and members because of all the rules he has put in place to keep the cost down and competition even.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 06:13AM
I be leave that everybody is entitled to there thoughts and opinions ,I agree with a lot of them with that being said I think that you cant beat a good CO Fair
that is run correctly they have a wide range of tractor s trucks and semis that 99.9% of people can enjoy and relate to and then you have the beer and
other events that get the other .01 % . I enjoy pulling when I can relate to the tractors and or class that are pulling, I also enjoy seeing where I started from
with entry level classes at any range . I also enjoy pulls that interest the first time pullers or the old neighbor hood banter as well as the veteran that is a winner
and see what he or she did over the winter to better the truck or tractor.
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Full Metal Jacket February 28, 2017 07:29AM
For what its worth, Joel Kingen has one of the toughest pro stocks around with MM sheetmetal and a JD engine. He's been trying to sell it for over half a year, and based on him putting up another ad, it appears there aren't many takers.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/28/2017 08:14AM by The Original Michael.
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Re: Full Metal Jacket February 28, 2017 07:58AM
Not saying that it isnt worth it, as Im sure you cant build it for 160k, but it is still gonna be hard to find a MM guy that can afford a used $160k prostock. And that MM guy would prolly not be too fond of the BBJD in it. Not knocking the tractor, awesome ride, just giving my .02.
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Re: Full Metal Jacket February 28, 2017 08:07AM
I suppose folks dont build a pulling tractor with "is going to be easy to get rid of?" as the first thought, but the more "niche" your vehicle is, seems like the harder it would be to find a buyer. That said, it only takes 1 person who's check clears to like it Smiling



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/28/2017 08:15AM by The Original Michael.
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Re: Full Metal Jacket February 28, 2017 10:15AM
From what I have found, If you explain to the fans on why they choose to use a certain block for competition purposes and that the reliability of the original oem block could not hold up to the strain of what it takes to be competitive, Most the die hard fans understand and realize the loyalty of the owner/driver rides on the sheet metal and have some respect for the fact they are trying to keep that make in the sport
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Re: Full Metal Jacket February 28, 2017 01:13PM
The easy fix to keep all brands in any of the classes would be cubic inch limits theres no reason for 600 pluss cubes in prostocks 5 hundred would have been more than enough problem solved color without the cross dressers
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Re: Full Metal Jacket February 28, 2017 03:07PM
Quote
lewis
The easy fix to keep all brands in any of the classes would be cubic inch limits theres no reason for 600 pluss cubes in prostocks 5 hundred would have been more than enough problem solved color without the cross dressers

Again, I said that very same thing 20 years ago. The light ss class never should have been 505, but when I said that, everyone said I didn't know what I was talking about.
Now look at all the classes today!
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Re: Full Metal Jacket March 01, 2017 06:20AM
Quote
lewis
The easy fix to keep all brands in any of the classes would be cubic inch limits theres no reason for 600 pluss cubes in prostocks 5 hundred would have been more than enough problem solved color without the cross dressers

Please explain how the lower cubic inch limits solve any cross dressing issues. 505, 510 Europro, 540 light pro have all seen multiple catastrophic block failures. Yes cubic inch limits do keep some brands out of the equation due to capacity. However many, not all, but many of these same models do not compete in lesser cubic inch classes without a repower to a different brand engine used later in the lineage of their family line.
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Re: Full Metal Jacket March 01, 2017 01:24PM
It wouldn't matter if anyone of us on here had the answer to fix all classes its not going to happen .The classes ends up fixing there self by dying and starting over with a new name that's why we have so many classes. And a lot of us try to pull in classes that is over our budget my yearly income tells me i should be in a 3mph antique class because now I need a 5000 dollar turbo and a 10.000 dollar set of tires that I cant afford to compete
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. February 28, 2017 04:29PM
No one will ever appreciate a component until you own one and have clutch or rear-end trouble.... Big money has ruined pulling no question about that. The two red tractors,two orange tractors and the two green tractors dominating the classes right now will eventually get tired of it just like another big money man from Ohio did. Once you spend so much money and stay at the top it gets old to them and they're done with it. Next,diesel and alcohols should not run together,no matter what you do it will always be to inconsistent. Also they sheet metal rule is crap,guys are aloud to build anything they want like that but a certain puller from Illinois can't build a V-8 john deere engine because it was out of a 4 wheel drive tractor and not 2 wheel drive. And honestly more john deere pro stocks would turn heads if they all didn't look the same. They are either 502ps or 7930s I mean geezer how hard it to pick a different sheet metal. As we sit here and complain about big money in pulling we have to listen to announcers at Louisville about "growing pulling" and getting big sponsor's back and on tractors.....so we want to keep the cost down but then bring sponsors in to back a big guy and then the little guy still can't keep up....now that sounds like nascar. Also I'm a little tired of seeing of the stuff about getting rid of diesel supers and alky supers....you want to get rid of something?? Get rid of super farms.....dump the the big cubes and the little turbo,build a 540 with a p-pump and go light pro it's a much better show and we don't have to hear about the illegal fuel or water
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Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 01, 2017 09:11AM
I also am a huge fan of the component chassis, as a person that views the sport through the lens of a fan I want to see the vehicles on the track and not in the repair shop. The component not only is more durable but also the repair time is drastically reduced. I think everyone can agree that the vast majority of national level pullers in the classes that allow components are now running them.

Which brings me to wonder if it isn't time to take a look at the weight that the tractors in the component legal classes are allowed to weigh. I believe that it would help show quality to lower the weights in these classes. In the LSS I would like to see them hook at 5800 lbs., in the DSS 7000 lbs. The Open SS 7500 lbs., and the PS 8500 Lbs. While I realize that this can only be achieved in well thought out increments, I would like to see the classes go to these respective weights over a 4 year period. I think that these lower weights will result in a not only an exciting show but may also level the playing field a little.


Dick Morgan

www.PULLOFF.com
Independent Pulling News



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/01/2017 09:12AM by Dick Morgan.
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 01, 2017 09:54AM
Dick, I'd be interested to hear your take on how that would make for instance the prostock class more exciting and what you would have to do to make that transition?
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 01, 2017 12:28PM
I don't really think that the transaction to 8500 would be that hard. And anytime you take weight away the vehicle is going dance around more. What do you think are two highest HP to weight ratios classes on the track today and how do you view their performance? And I know that if you look at NTPA results from several years ago you will see that Brian Shramek hooked his " The King of Deeres" PS several times in the DSS class.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/01/2017 12:38PM by Dick Morgan.
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 01, 2017 01:15PM
It will necessitate one major change for certain
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 02, 2017 12:26AM
The weight change would be interesting.

Definitely change the complexion of the classes. I know right now some are struggling with enough weight on the nose at 8000.


Go back to the old 7500ss. Definitely put driving and weighting at more of premium.


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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/02/2017 01:23AM by AV.
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 02, 2017 05:58AM
Dick, I got to disagree with the weight changes in pro stock alone. The reason is these drivers are peddling the throttle constantly trying to hook up 3500+ hp with 24.5 tires. Yes I know schramek ran a pro stock in the DSS class but he also had 30.5 tires on and there was a discussion a couple years ago on this board about pro stocks running 30.5's. most the pullers that chimed in didn't have any interest. We have reached a point in limited pro where these guys are peddling and slipping the clutch unless it is a great track and we all know that every track is great
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 02, 2017 06:23AM
Sully for the win
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 02, 2017 06:46AM
Sully I thought about that when I was advocating reducing the weight in the PS class to 8500 lbs. And what my reasoning is that if a PPL mod with 10,000 plus HP at 7800 lbs. can hook up on 30.5 then I believe that a 3500 HP PS at 8500 lbs with 1/3 the HP and 10 % more weight than the PPL mods is not really out of the question.


Dick Morgan

www.PULLOFF.com
Independent Pulling News
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 02, 2017 07:20AM
Taking off with a V8 and feathering the throttle out of the hole to hook it up is a little different than having to have a 5.5" or multiple turbos spooled before you can start to think about moving.

Clutch will only do so much.


The sled setting would be changed some to accommodate, just not sure there is enough difference out of the hole to matter there.


COO for OTTPA

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www.truck-specialties.com

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/02/2017 07:23AM by AV.
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 07, 2017 01:45AM
Less weight in any class means less margin of error in your setup, which always adds to the shows excitement. It also changes the game from a purely horsepower game to a setup and driving game. As we've seen in the past, when horsepower is everything and setup is of minimal importance then it encourages cookie cutter motors/chassis/etc... When horsepower becomes another variable of less importance is when all the money in the world won't just buy you a win.

Yes, building lighter vehicles has a slightly higher initial cost, but I think the long-term benefit for the class(es) and the sport far outweighs that initial cost. I'd much rather see a setup war vs. an hugely costly horsepower war.


Jake Morgan
Owner, PULLOFF.COM
Independent Pulling News


This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/07/2017 05:13AM by Jake Morgan.

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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 07, 2017 05:13AM
Maybe I'm not following correctly but it seems what you are after is an increase in wild rides? For the record and I'm sure you know this but in none of todays classes is setup of minimal importance. In fact it is the reason you see smooth passes. Horsepower is only a portion of a consistently successful team.
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 07, 2017 05:48AM
Well, I don't want more wild rides, although that is more common at lighter weights due to the smaller margins for error. That said, even though I don't want them they are fan favorite. I was talking about this exact same thing with Jason Hootman yesterday. He mentioned that the video of his front tires flying off THe Commander at Louisville in 2016 had tons and tons of views on Youtube, yet his wins in 2014 and 2015 didn't have nearly as many views. That alone tells me that there's interest in wild rides. Add in the fact that the Wild Rides and Wrecks videos are some of the best selling pulling videos and I think the evidence is clear that people like crazy extreme stuff.

Wild Rides isn't the goal, it's just minor side effect. In the beginning of the sport it was a battle of creativity and ingenuity. People built on the cheap and tried crazy things to see if it would work or not. It was an economical sport and it had some crazy, fun, and interesting creations. It's evolved and nowadays it's a cookie cutter follow the leader sport where everyone runs a similar setup and the majority of competitors write a check and put in a Sassy/Miner/Hypermax/BBJD/Salenbein/etc... to stay at the top of the horsepower game. The reason is simple, we're in an era where horsepower is the most important variable. It's not the only variable, but right now it's king. That's what the sport has evolve to and the current rules allow and even promote cookie cutter powerplants. We need to evolve again and take some of the emphasis off of horsepower and make the other variables more important. We need to turn it into a driver/setup battle not a horsepower battle.

The biggest common complaint is that the sport is too expensive and that you can just buy horsepower to win. The best way to combat those too things is to make it more about driving, and setup and less about what the dyno numbers say. That's the true goal of lowering weights.


Jake Morgan
Owner, PULLOFF.COM
Independent Pulling News


This page is a free service. The cost is covered out of my pocket. It takes a great deal of time and a fair amount of money to keep this website going. Donations for: photos, classified ads, forum discussion, etc... are appreciated.

Side Note: We are no longer accepting PayPal donations. They have changed their terms of service and stated they would fine PayPal users for spreading "misinformation" and "hate, violence, racial or other forms of intolerance that is discriminatory". PayPal did not provide definitions for some of these vague terms. Woke corporate policies regarding "misinformation" could result in an automatic fine of $2,500 which would have been removed directly from the customer’s PayPal account. PayPal did backdown from some of their policies but quietly implemented portions of them in later terms of service. A financial institute has no right to monitor social media accounts or speech. This is unacceptable and I'll no longer do business with PayPal.

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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 07, 2017 06:40AM
IMO lowering weights will not change any of that. Particularly the expense, R&D will be solely invested in programs to utilize horsepower potential at the lighter weights.
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lower weight = more $$$ March 07, 2017 07:03AM
Lowering the weight limit will only enhance the advantage of those who can spend big money. Those who can put enough weight on the front would have a large advantage. Light parts are expensive. There are already plenty of titanium bolts in the rear portions of tractors. Ask Engler if you doubt it.
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Re: lower weight = more excitement March 07, 2017 11:56AM
First, lets look at the Pro Stock class: 90% are already component tractors. Most probably weight sub-7000 lbs already. If you've ever looked underneath many of the tractors there are hidden belly bars just stuffed with weights. So I'd say there's not much of a cost to drop 1000 lbs for the vast majority of the PS class. Cost would be minimal or $0 for most guys. It would really make guys learn to drive them out of the hole differently. Crafty veterans like Don Masterson would probably shine with track reading and driving style.

Next take the Open/Unlimited Super Stock class, watch the video of Louisville on Thursday Evening. Almost everyone in the class missed their weight because they got greedy or simply underestimated the track. If Kyle Karlen ran his Bad Blood LSS in the class with a balanced setup he probably would have made the finals and he could have made the podium. That's how important proper setup is. Imagine if you took 500 lbs away fro those guys. That margin of error for a perfect setup and a perfect driving job would be razor thin. That would definitely make horsepower much, much less of a factor. Those big V-8's would be kings of the dyno but maybe not kings of the clay.

Let's look at the LSS class; I'd go out on a limb and say that Brian Korth was on the most powerful tractor in that class on Saturday morning. I'd wager a guess that it's actually more powerful than the tractor the Terry Blackbourn drove. Yet he wasn't on the podium. Setup and driving matter more in this class than any other tractor class simply because the margin for error is already razor thin and it's not always horsepower that wins. The 5th place tractor of Brice Terry didn't have a great night, it didn't run very clean, it sounded really fat to me and yet he still got a very, very respectable 5th because he did a great driving job and the setup was perfect for how it ran. Don't get me wrong, Too Hy Strung is one of the most capable tractors in the class, but on that given Saturday it wasn't even close to it's full potential and it still made top 5 because of setup. Image if you made that class 6000 lbs? Setup would need to be perfect every single time you hooked to the sled.

There are endless examples of guys that are short on moveable weight but high on horsepower and they don't win because they just don't have that margin of error in their setup. Lighter weight ALWAYS makes that margin of error just a little thinner.


Jake Morgan
Owner, PULLOFF.COM
Independent Pulling News


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Re: lower weight = more excitement March 07, 2017 01:09PM
i will weigh in on this "pun intended". we run our mini-rods with 3 different organizations, 2 of them have the exact same rules, same tractors, for the most part. ITPA, and IPA , we have a 6-71 at 10% on a 380 ci small block. weight was 1900 last year. goes to 1950 for this year. We dyno our motors at Englkings, (best guy around in my opinion) we make about 1250 HP on the dyno, then detune them a bit for a 40-45 hook season. we don't tear them down all year, unless we hurt something. no time for me!!! With Tri-County in wis. we have much looser rules...8-71 at whatever ya want for overdrive. Unrestricted turbo tractors. even have a small hemi with an 8-71!! We dont change our set-ups from one org. to another, as we also work for a living too!! time is a factor!! LOL . we do fine with the clubs with the same rules that we are set up for. when we pull with the TRI-CO. bunch, we are out powered by about 150-200 HP. BUT!! we can hang with them,mostly because we can get them down the track consistently. at this falls meetings in tri co. a few of the pullers wanted to up the weight another 50 lbs, so they can put it on the front and utilize that superior power. it was voted down, as we believe it would seriously divide the field. Less is better!! Stacy Butson
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Re: lower weight = more excitement March 07, 2017 06:54PM
I agree lighter weights also in super farm. Also a 4,500 LB unlimited Single engine mod class for State and RG level. Mod tractors will be done soon if they don't do some thing soon.
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 02, 2017 10:24AM
I'm wondering if you have thought about torque? I'm thinking that a multi mod has big hp at the ground but i bet not the torque. Just like hooking up 4-12 volt batteries in parallel. You have more amps/hp but still 12v/torque. Im not sure watching tractors slipping bouncing and over revving there motors would be any fun for the guy who has $200k in their ps tractor just to amuse a $20 ticket holder. If a fan wants that go see a demolition derby then go to one, for me i want to c a pull and power to the ground.
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 09, 2017 07:33AM
I'm confused as to why we should lower the weights in all of these classes. What is currently wrong with them that you feel needs to be improved upon? What is currently wrong with the LSS class that you feel a lower weight will fix? Are they running too close? Too loose? Will it add more pullers to the class? What is wrong with the Pro stocks that lowering the weight will improve upon? Why do all of the classes have to fit into a perfect little box? What is wrong with going to a pull and watching the Super Farms all run within 10 feet of each other, followed by the mini rods which are all over the place, followed by the Pro stocks and then a class of Heavy Supers? You just got to watch 4 very different classes with 4 very different results. Isn't that what pulling is all about? As a lifelong fan I can tell what you should do to grow pulling: QUIT MESSING WITH IT SO MUCH!!! Half of the pullers don't even know what's going on with the other classes, but you expect some guy off of the street to be able to figure it out? One class is a pull-off and the next one is a floating finish. Do you think that could get confusing? Now Outlaws have a class where different colors have different weights? You all keep saying it's about the fans and then all you do is make changes for the pullers. I get it, they are the ones putting up the big money, but my $20 ticket and $4 beer shouldn't be forgotten about either. I also think the comment about Hootman's youtube videos is a joke. If you want to start catering to "fans" that just want to watch stuff blow-up, then start taking dynamite to the shows. I go to watch pulling. There are more pulls now then there have ever been, so how exactly is the sport dying? Hillsboro didn't even exist 10 years ago. There only used to be one pull in the winter and now there are about 8. So what is it that you are really shooting for here? More pulls with more pullers and more fans. What seems to be the problem?
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 09, 2017 11:56AM
Nice Rant! You honestly hit the nail right on the head, let's grow pulling by leaving it alone for more than a month.......
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Re: Time to think about lowering the weight in component legal classes. March 09, 2017 01:07PM
I agree completely!
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. March 07, 2017 11:34AM
One idea would cure many of the current problems however no one is going to like it ! Drop the drawbar down to 18 inches , the extra horsepower many are looking for on the dyno's would not be beneficial ,expensive dyno time would not be needed curing the problem of explosions in the dyno room that prove to be quite costly let alone damage to the building , it would be less wear and tear on the sled's , tractor's would not be put under the stress they are now so it would be safer for everyone involved . It would be more of a drivers sport than the current power sport . Set up for different track conditions would come into play , just an idea no one will like . Cheaper turbo's , less stress on the clutch , big cubes would not have a huge advantage . cheaper all the way around .
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. March 07, 2017 03:58PM
make the sleds pulling sleds again instead of race sleds. heavy sleds will level the horsepower gap as you can only drag something as fast as it will let you before blowing tires loose. todays sled settings are a race to see how fast you can go before the pan drops. horsepower with minimal drag of the sled equals ground speed which is why its a hp game. on occasion you will get a horsepower track that the big hp engines will dominate but you are getting that every time now.
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. March 07, 2017 10:55PM
Heavy sleds pull the whole track I AGREE 100% but I'm old school
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. March 07, 2017 11:39PM
There's a class for that now, it's called antique pulling, nothing against antique pulling but their show is not built on speed. Nothing can ruin the show and the fans interest faster than watching a slow heavy sled. Motorsports are about speed and the only way pulling has any speed is with todays sleds that are able to let the vehicles get up and running and then bring them to a safe consistent stop.


Dick Morgan

www.PULLOFF.com
Independent Pulling News
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. March 12, 2017 05:55AM
My 2 cents. To take tractor pulling to the next level our sleds have to be changed. Someone needs to find a way to make a light sled that can be used for mini rods up to unlimited mods. I also think that box turbos is also a good idea even for llss. Speed sleds are awesome but with speed you need horsepower. That makes it a $$$ sport. When its a $$$ sport you limit the amount of people that can be involved. When you limit the people involved you have less people in the stands because every puller brings his supporters and fans with him. The more $$$ an event makes the more an organization can charge to put the event on. When $$$ becomes the issue the person with the most $$$ wins. Chizek with hired help blackburn, boyds with hired help shannon leischner, galot with payne. They wont always win but chances are much greater. If less $$$ involved in pulling i know a lot of pullers out there that have beaten pullers with more $$$ but now days you have to have a $100,000 or more hauler just to get noticed. $$$ is what ruined nascar. Tshirts shot into stands should be autographed. Also should do like monster trucks and have a fan appreciation meet and greet with kids on the track. Kids involved will get them involved when they can have their own pulling truck/tractor if they can AFFORD it
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. March 12, 2017 08:58AM
Amen
You hit the nail on the head thank you
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. March 12, 2017 03:53PM
Agreed good pts. We pass out our books full of photos and advertisements to any kid that wants one free and encourage them to get pics autographed , proceeds from the ones we sell gies to the local Ronald mcdonalds house
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Re: New Opinion Article: Pulling can not go down the same destructive road that NASCAR has chosen. March 12, 2017 11:01PM
To keep are sport moving forward, we at the local levels need to stay active in are comuities. We pull at several benefit pulls were the money raised stays local. Are club gets exposure by being interviewed on the radio, tv adds and are sponsors gets that same exposure, which keeps them coming back and more what to come on board . Put a good reasonable product on the track and the fans will stay and more will come.
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